[Jeff3]

Hi,

I've got a 2014 Hyundai i30 GD Active Hatch, 1.6l diesel manual, just had the 15000km service done.  It’s been a great car other than a low level vibration that gets annoying on long trips.  Checks and alignments by the dealer and a tyre place have not resolved the vibration issue. 

As part of the service I got a report from the dealer that indicated that the front alignment was 0 mm and 6 mm toe in at the rear.  They indicated that the rear alignment was not ideal but that there was nothing they could do about it as there was no adjustment on the rear.  I am now wondering if this rear alignment issue may be the cause of the vibration.

There are a couple of questions I'm hoping you can help me with:

Is there really no way to adjust the rear alignment on the current i30 ? (I thought this sounded very strange for a modern car)?

Is the 6mm toe in at the rear significant or outside of Hyundai specs and would this be likely to cause vibration or uneven tyre wear?

Thanks
Jeff

[Johnno]

Hi Jeff and welcome to the forum.

Can you feel the vibration through the steering wheel, or does all the car vibrate and is it a constant vibrate at any speed or does it get a bit more intense the faster you go?

What did the tyre shop actually check? wheel balance on all four wheels? and if it was, was it checked on the car or off 

[pidim]

is it correct that there is no wheel alignment possible for the rear wheels?  If so, there is one particular HY dealer which quotes a price for front or front/rear for the GD.

[Surferdude]

I'm not sure about the GD rear end alignment wise.
You could probably make a case for at least checking the rear though.

Anyway,  if there is 6mm toe in, I think that's a bit excessive (of the top of my head).
If so,  there may be some uneven wear on the rear tyres and that would cause a vibration.  It would also sound a bit like a wheel bearing.
Balancing won't get rid of a vibration from uneven wear. You'll nee someone who knows what they're doing to inspect it though.  The wear won't be all the cway round the tyre.

[cruiserfied]

Some GD's are torsion beam rear with no adjustments and some are independent with adjustment.
In Australia the Korean built have the beam axle (5-door hatch) and the Czech built have the ind. rear (3-door & wagon)
I don't know if this is worldwide or not.

[Dazzler]

Welcome jeff,

I have heard at least one story on here similar to yours which was traced to a badly manufactured tyre (which took some diagnosing)

I think member Alan Ho posted about it (hopefully he will see my post and comment)

[Jeff3]

Thanks for your responses.  I think mine is the torsion beam variety.

The vibration is more noticeable at high speed and on rougher roads but it is there even at low speed.  I can mainly feel it through the steering wheel but to a lesser extent through my feet in the footwell.   It is at a fairly low level and only annoying over longer periods, neither the dealer or the tyre guy thought there was a problem from driving it. 

The dealer did a wheel alignment early on (at about 1000k's) which reduced but didn't remove the vibration.  The tyre guy checked the alignment and told me that it didn't need adjustment .  Given that the report from the Safe-t-stop test lists the front wheels at 0 and the rear at 6mm is don't think either of them looked at the rear wheels.   

The vibration has been there since new so I don't think tyre wear is the cause. 

If a 6mm rear toe in is excessive and the alignment can't be adjusted is there anything I can do about it ? 

Cheers,
Jeff

[Lorian]

Tyres been re-balanced all round?

[Jeff3]

@ Dazzler - I've had the wheels rotated front to back with no effect which I thought would have at least changed the effect of a bad tyre, I have wondered if it was worth swapping each wheel for the spare to see if anything changed. 

@ Lorian - I assumed that they would have checked this for me when doing the alignment but in hindsight this is probably giving then too much credit. 

[AlanHo]

You have a good memory Dazz.

A few years back I had a Toyota Avensis which developed a slight vibration above a certain speed accompanied by a growling noise. I was sure it was a front wheel bearing or a drive shaft CV joint. 

The dealership had the car in and I accompanied the technician on a road test. He was of the same opinion - a front wheel bearing or CV joint. They then checked the bearings and drive shafts but found they were fine.

They then carried out an alignment check - it was perfect so the mystery remained.

They then swapped the tyres - front to rear and tested the car again - the vibration was significantly reduced but the growl now appeared to come from the rear of the car indicating a problem with one of the wheels.

They removed the wheels and found a few very slight bulges on one of the tyre treads which you could depress with a finger. They deflated the tyre and it was obvious that the tread was delaminating in strips at various points on the tyre. They then fitted a new tyre and investigated the faulty one. They found that the whole tread had come adrift from the carcass - other than in short places where it was still adhered. The growl and vibration must have been caused by the tread moving along the carcass under the contact area.

I was amazed that a tyre could cause so much vibration and a really strong growling noise - but you live and learn.

The car was only 12 months old at the time and had done about 10k so it was all done under warranty.

[Surferdude]

If you have vibration in both the steering wheel and under your feet id be looking at balance. 

[Johnno]

@ Dazzler - I've had the wheels rotated front to back with no effect which I thought would have at least changed the effect of a bad tyre, I have wondered if it was worth swapping each wheel for the spare to see if anything changed. 

@ Lorian - I assumed that they would have checked this for me when doing the alignment but in hindsight this is probably giving then too much credit.

I'd go for that Jeff, change each wheel with the spare so to eliminate the wheels and tyres

[Dazzler]

@ Dazzler - I've had the wheels rotated front to back with no effect which I thought would have at least changed the effect of a bad tyre, I have wondered if it was worth swapping each wheel for the spare to see if anything changed. 

@ Lorian - I assumed that they would have checked this for me when doing the alignment but in hindsight this is probably giving then too much credit.

I'd go for that Jeff, change each wheel with the spare so to eliminate the wheels and tyres

 

and thanks to Alan 

[Johnno]

sorry about the text being small in the image.
On some tyres there's a band going around the tyre near to the rim, have a look all the way round and see if that band is roughly equal distance from the rim. In the past I've come across the tyre's that are not seated correctly and effetely the tyre is egg shaped on the rim thus giving vibration's.
Also like Alan as stated about defected tyres, i've also seen tyres where the compounds have separated and it only as to be a couple of mm out for it to cause vibrations, we use to use a DTI stand with a gauge to measure the run out on the tyre as its hardly impossible to see depending on the severity of the defect
Also have a look to see if any balancing weights on the rim have come away, if a weight as come off it normally leaves a black outline on the rim where it should of been.

just a couple of idea's for you can check yourself

[Surferdude]

^^^^
That first link errors out Johnno.

I think all tyres have the GG groove (band).

At least I've never seen one which didn't.
Even in super cheap stuff from India.

Good point though.
Edit: Links gone. 

[Jeff3]

Thanks everyone.  I'll check the tyres are on evenly and shuffle the spare around the 4 corners in the next few days and see if anything changes.  Hopefully I can work out the location of any tyre/balance issues.

Cheers,
Jeff

[Surferdude]

Thanks everyone.  I'll check the tyres are on evenly and shuffle the spare around the 4 corners in the next few days and see if anything changes.  Hopefully I can work out the location of any tyre/balance issues.

Cheers,
Jeff

Let us know how you go, Jeff.

[Jeff3]

I'm getting better at changing tyres but I haven't learnt anything useful.

All the tyres looked to be seated correctly and I couldn't see any balance weights missing.

If there is a wheel balance or tyre issue then it must be more than one, each wheel one has spent time in the boot without any noticeable change.

I think I'll get a balance done and see if that makes any difference, I'll have a talk to them about the rear alignment as well.

[eye30]

Here is quick way to check whether wheel is balanced without equipment.

Place the wheel on an item which will allow you to balance the wheel from its centre point.

If balance the wheel will balance on its centre point. If not it will tip over.
By tipping over then the part that tips is too heavy so the opposite side requires a weight.


Here is a more accurate way

http://faq.ninja250.org/wiki/How_can_I_balance_the_tires_by_myself%3F

[Surferdude]

Here is quick way to check whether wheel is balanced without equipment.

Place the wheel on an item which will allow you to balance the wheel from its centre point.

If balance the wheel will balance on its centre point. If not it will tip over.
By tipping over then the part that tips is too heavy so the opposite side requires a weight.


Here is a more accurate way

How can I balance the tires by myself? - Ninja250Wiki

That DOES work "eye".
But a wheel and tyre assembly which fails that test may not necessarily cause a vibration. It (sort of) depends on how quickly it tilts. 

If Jeff has tried replacing each tyre with the spare without any noticeable change I'm beginning to suspect a drive shaft or hub may be a problem. I've seen instances where a drive shaft problem can be felt bot in the steering wheel and the bum.

[Hornet]

Could this problem be due to an out of round tyre? Happened to me once was a fault in the tyre. Poor quality glue used in the tyre I was told.
Cannot see where this has been suggested. Hope it might help.

[Dazzler]

Could this problem be due to an out of round tyre? Happened to me once was a fault in the tyre. Poor quality glue used in the tyre I was told.
Cannot see where this has been suggested. Hope it might help.

Member has switched each tyre out with the spare so doesn't appear to be a tyre issue.

[Johnno]

At the end of the day it's a 2014 vehicle and HY should be doing all this not the owner, The only thing left is the suspension and drive shafts like Surferdude said.

[Johnno]

The only other thing I can think of but its more expense and you shouldn't be footing the bill is to have all wheels balanced off the car then find a tyre shop that as a wheel balancing machine that balances wheels still on the car.

Now they should do is to put the magnetic sensor's say on the front offside suspension close to the bottom ball joint about 3mm away run up the machine on that what offside wheel and any vibration will be picked up through the sensor. Do it on all four corners and the one corner that as the most vibration is the place to inspect. I used to use one of these machines and they are great for this sort of problems.

Had a Triumph Stag in the workshop once which had a vibration, went through all the above and found the vibration was worse on the rear but could not pin point it till I put the sensor near to  the propshaft and the sensor picked up the strongest reading and thats where the fault lies, on a closer look at the prop had lost one of its weights, so to save the customer money  I fitted a jubilee clip and re balanced it with that. job done.

But like i said HY should be looking into it .... The same principle can be applied to a front wheel drive vehicle