i30 Owners Club
GOT PROBLEMS OR ISSUES? => DIESEL => Topic started by: jbh500 on June 01, 2012, 19:28:59
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Hi everyone, been an avid reader of the forum for a while but only just registered! I have a 2010 1.6 CRDi 115PS CW with 5400 miles on the clock. I have owned the car from new. When I bought the car I was so impressed by how refined the diesel engine was - the most un-diesel like diesel I had ever driven! After 5400 miles though I have a bit of a problem that came on suddenly. The engine now has a harsher tone to it, especially around 1500 RPM and when I pull away under load in 2nd or 3rd gear from around 1200 RPM there is a loud knocking sound (like pinking in a petrol car only louder) until the engine gets to around 2000 RPM. It sounds like fuel detonation at the wrong time and seems worse when the engine is hot. Even my wife noticed the difference in sound when she drove the car and she is not very mechanically minded - she said it sounded much louder, like an old style diesel! The car runs ok besides this and the fuel economy hasn't changed. I have checked the oil and water and they are fine. I have got the car booked in with Hyundai next week but I was interested to see if anyone else had seen this problem so I could be armed with more information when the car goes in! Thanks in advance to anyone who takes the time to reply!
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I don't have a diesel myself, but the other members who have sing there praises constantly, I am sure some of them will be along anytime soon to chat with you bout this.... you've done the right thing so far, dealership visit :goodjob: :goodjob: :goodjob:
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Welcome jbh,
We did 68000 kilometres in our previous 2008 Diesel Hatch without a hiccup..
Not a common symptom although original U series Diesel Motor (as against the later U2 version) didn't like being under load in higher gears under 1500 Rpm ..
You could disconnect the battery for half an hour or so to reset the ECU to see if that makes a difference (if you do the Stability Control Light will take a time to reset as well)
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I have nothing really to add as I haven't had these issues either but hope it's resolved satisfactorily.
Mine is the origin U too.
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Not a common symptom although original U series Diesel Motor (as against the later U2 version) didn't like being under load in higher gears under 1500 Rpm ..
You could disconnect the battery for half an hour or so to reset the ECU to see if that makes a difference (if you do the Stability Control Light will take a time to reset as well)
:whsaid:
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Hi jbh500 & welcome aboard,
As an avid reader of the forum topics you will know that this is not a common problem. I suggest a few more revs before changing gear. The dealer should be able to sort any problems. Maybe suggest an early oil change too, to be on the safe side. Let us know how you fare. :goodjob2:
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Hi guys, thanks for the quick replies! Looks like this isn't a common issue but I think I will give the ECU reset a try today and let you know how that goes!
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Hello again, I disconnected the battery for about 45 minutes yesterday to reset the ECU as suggested. The ESP OFF light stayed on for a while afterwards just as stated! I have done around 5 miles but the car doesn't seem any better, if anything slightly worse. It may take a few more miles to "re-learn" the settings maybe? I have got a few trips to do over the next few days so I will see if anything changes! Booked in at my local Hyundai dealer on Thursday!
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Shame that didn't work. But it is one possibility you can now tick off. Hope it gets sorted Thursday :goodjob:
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Timing chain tensioner is the next thing that springs to mind, but good call on the ECU reset
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jbh500, do you have DPF in your car?
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Hi, no my car does not have a DPF!
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Hi, just got back from local Hyundai dealer. The first thing they did was to come out with me in the car so that I could demonstrate the sound. Once I had demonstrated the engine sound to the technician he said that it was "diesel knock". He said that there didn't appear to be a problem with the engine as such and that the system is very closely monitored by the ECU which would throw up a warning light if there was a real problem. The first thing they want to rule out is the fuel quality. The current tank of fuel is supermarket stuff and the technician said that until they could rule out poor fuel there was not a lot else they could do. They have asked me to run the tank low and then fill up with quality fuel such as Shell or BP. Once that fuel has had chance to get through the system they want me to let them know if the problem has been solved or not, if not then to book the car back in! It will probably take me a couple of weeks to run the tank low and refuel so I will report back after that!
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The first thing they want to rule out is the fuel quality. The current tank of fuel is supermarket stuff and the technician said that until they could rule out poor fuel there was not a lot else they could do. They have asked me to run the tank low and then fill up with quality fuel such as Shell or BP.
Interesting...............
When I had my diesel I always used Shell and had no trouble.
On the odd occasion I used Tesco's fuel, after getting a money off voucher, I did notice a change in how the car performed but returned to its old self once I refilled with Shell..
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Seems a bit of an odd one... It's "diesel knock" but ... I guess time will tell. :confused:
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I confirm this observation. At some moment, my 90hp CRDI started to produce 'metallic detonation' 'old-diesel style' sound at 1500-1900 RPM when accelerating. I was driving mostly urban-style in last month, no motorway trips. I did not care so much, but today I
- filled the tank at another station
- did a 200km trip on motorway, 130-140kmph @ 2500+ RPM.
-> the metallic sound went away! Now it has that normal 'velvet', low sound even at lower ~1000 RPM.
So, my first conclusions -
either my previous fuel supplier sucks
or having DPF non-regenerated for a long time makes ECU to control the engine in a non-optimal way.
BTW, my friend with 1.5 dci Nissan complained on the same symptoms. I think he gets gasoline on the same (presumably wrong) station. I'll advice him to change, just to see how this helps.
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It would appear that fuel can be a contributing factor to unexplained engine anomalies. I suggest people with any apparent engine malfunctions try a different fuel supplier, it may save a lot of time and headaches looking for something mechanical / electrical that's not even there. :neutral:
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It would appear that fuel can be a contributing factor to unexplained engine anomalies. I suggest people with any apparent engine malfunctions try a different fuel supplier, it may save a lot of time and headaches looking for something mechanical / electrical that's not even there. :neutral:
A possible problem with that suggestion is that someone may continue to run the car for several hundred km to use up the old fuel when they actually have a mechanical problem that then causes more damage. Maybe OK if you are still in warranty - but could be expensive if not.
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Very good point Alan... :goodjob:
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I only use Shell in my Crdi unless Im away and need to fill up. However, occasionally my wife uses my car and will fill it up with Tesco's Diesel and I see a drop in MPG and the car isn't as responsive.
i30Sean
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Hi everyone, sorry for the long time between posts but I wanted to make sure that I posted up a worthwhile response! Thanks for the replies in between! After the visit to Hyundai I let the tank get low until the fuel warning light came on and then filled up with Shell diesel. I then went on a 120 mile motorway round trip and have since been running around for a few more days. On the 120 mile motorway trip the car performed really well and averaged around 50 MPG. I have to say that there has been no difference in the noises and symptoms at all so far! I am going to run a bit more with the new fuel and if there is no improvement then its back to Hyundai! I'll keep posting updates when I have anything new to tell!
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I hope it's sorted to your satisfaction.
I guess I'm lucky because I quite like the diesel sound in an engine but I can't say that it's been excessive in my car.
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Still doesn't sound right to me.. if you know what I mean :confused:
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someone may continue to run the car for several hundred km to use up the old fuel when they actually have a mechanical problem that then causes more damage. Maybe OK if you are still in warranty - but could be expensive if not.
I hope Alan's not foretelling the future :scared:
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I think he might have been a fortune teller in his earlier life :undecided:
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good old fashioned 'labouring the engine' its a tiny engine, your driving it like its a 6-71!! keep it above 1500 rpm and it will be happy, they do perform very well to 3500 rpm!!
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Hi, I don't think it's the way I drive it because it has been perfect up to 5400 miles and then suddenly things changed. I have driven another i30 with the same engine for 10 days and that behaved perfectly as well! I didn't drive that any differently! With regards to keeping it above 1500 RPM thats not always possible. Sometimes you slow down for a junction in 2nd gear, have a look and then pull away from a slow speed without actually stopping. The car has never been bothered by this before but now if I do this it makes the diesel knock sound quite badly as it pulls through 1500 rpm up to around 2000 rpm then is quietens down. It has also started making the horrible diesel knock sound in 1st gear as I accelarate away from standstill. The engine now just feels harsher and not as smooth. Things don't seem to be improving with Shell fuel so I will probably be booking it back in with Hyundai soon!
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Could it be the Tappets need to be checked and adjusted?
Or even
an injector is defective?
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Hi, yes I'm thinking a defective injector could be the problem too! I wonder how keen Hyundai will be to start replacing injectors :undecided:
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I feel for you jbh :blubber: These type of faulty are a pain if the Dealer drags their feet finding it ... :fum:
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My local Hyundai dealer has a very good reputation - time to put them to the test I guess!
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Well, at least 1 good thing. The dealer's mechanic has heard the problem and labelled it "diesel knock". That is recognition of a difference in the normal operating sound of the engine and as such, requires further investigation. They can't send you away saying you're imagining things or "all our engines sound like that" excuse. Hopefully, they'll be able to find & rectify the problem, although I haven't got any idea what this could be. If an injector was faulty, I'd expect the ecu to say so if it's monitored that intensely. :neutral:
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if its an injector failure the ecu won't log a code unless there is a fault in the electrical side of the injector circuit. the ecu can not detect a mechanical failure in an injector ie. broken or missing nozzle, or a scored or sticky needle.
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Good point kom, I was going to suggest that this problem would be in your area of expertise & invite you to pass your considered opinion on what's going on. :neutral:
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hard to say without hearing it for myself.
but here are a few possibilities
-may have dropped an injector or two (from water in the fuel or contaminated fuel)
-injector pump may be worn (from contaminated fuel) and down on pressure causeing the fuel to not completely atomise
-air filter may be blocked causing an excessively rich mixture when just off/coming onto boost
-depends on what the i30 diesels run, wether its a map sensor or mass airflow meter, may be faulty causing overfueling under certain engine loads
or it could be none of these :wacko: i would only be guessing without seeing/hearing it myself
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I trust your guesses better than mine, all of those are bad news indeed except the air filter & at the low distance the car has traveled, I hope you're wrong. :neutral:
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Thanks for the suggestions guys! It's always good to have as much information as possible when taking the car in to the dealer. I am going to try and get the car back in to Hyundai later next week. Maybe get a little i10 as a loaner too! Always fancied a go in one of them! :cool:
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I doubt it's anything serious, my suggestions above are just a few possibilities, hopefully it might be something as simple as a reflash of the ECU with updated software? Toyota did this with their V8 landcruisers when they first came out, to fix a similar problem.
Fingers crossed for a simple fix :mrgreen:
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Got the car booked in with Hyundai for next Tuesday :neutral: They haven't got an i10 available as a loaner but they can lend me a Getz :eek: I'm really hoping that they can find the problem!
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A getz is a great little car :goodjob: Hope they sort your problem quickly :goodjob:
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:whsaid:
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Hi everyone, been an avid reader of the forum for a while but only just registered! I have a 2010 1.6 CRDi 115PS CW with 5400 miles on the clock. I have owned the car from new. When I bought the car I was so impressed by how refined the diesel engine was - the most un-diesel like diesel I had ever driven! After 5400 miles though I have a bit of a problem that came on suddenly. The engine now has a harsher tone to it, especially around 1500 RPM and when I pull away under load in 2nd or 3rd gear from around 1200 RPM there is a loud knocking sound (like pinking in a petrol car only louder) until the engine gets to around 2000 RPM. It sounds like fuel detonation at the wrong time and seems worse when the engine is hot. Even my wife noticed the difference in sound when she drove the car and she is not very mechanically minded - she said it sounded much louder, like an old style diesel! The car runs ok besides this and the fuel economy hasn't changed. I have checked the oil and water and they are fine. I have got the car booked in with Hyundai next week but I was interested to see if anyone else had seen this problem so I could be armed with more information when the car goes in! Thanks in advance to anyone who takes the time to reply!
Hi jbh I have just joined this club but i have been reading alot of these comments on the i30 with interest. I am the owner of a Kia ceed Sw 1.6 crdi which uses the same engine as yours.I am a member of the Kia ceed forums, but have failed to find any body on there who has the same problem as mine. The symptons you are getting with your engine i am also getting exactly the same with mine. I have taken it back to the dealer only to be told that these engines are like that. I have found myself getting frustrated with the car as the engine at times sounds like a bag of nails. The car was purchased march it is on the 12 plate. Just wondered if your dealer managed to sort your noisy engine out so that i can go back to my dealer with a bit more clout to get mine sorted . cheers Robsteve.
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Hope you get all sorted, and everything is ok,
Mine is a petrol but it is going in on Tuesday for a tappet noise, my noise has stopped since I put BP in her. so fingers crossed all is ok.
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Welcome Robertsteve,
Hope our I30 solution applies to your car too. We are always happy to help out our "cousins" too :neutral:
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Welcome Robertsteve,
Hope our I30 solution applies to your car too. We are always happy to help out our "cousins" too :neutral:
:whsaid: I thought you might have been from Tasmania to start with :whistler:
One of our more active and popular members just bought the 2nd generation Ceed :eek:
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It's fixed! I had it in to the local Hyundai dealer on Tuesday and they test drove the car and confirmed the knocking / noise. They looked the issue up on the Hyundai database of known faults and found a technical service bulletin covering this exact problem! They replaced the injectors and now the car is back to its old smooth & quiet self! Very relieved! The little Getz that they lent me was fun too! Just a 1.1 GSi model but quite entertaining to drive apart from the indicators being on the wrong side! It's lovely to drive the i30 around again with the engine sounding sweet!
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Excellent result.
Congratulations. :goodjob:
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Excellent result.
Congratulations. :goodjob:
:whsaid:
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That's terrific :goodjob2: Glad you're happy, interesting they say it was the injector(s), does that mean they were all faulty at the same time. :wacko: Still it's fixed, that's the main thing & thanks for reporting back too. :goodjob2: :goodjob:
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The little Getz that they lent me was fun too! Just a 1.1 GSi model but quite entertaining to drive apart from the indicators being on the wrong side!
So how many times did you put the wipers on to turn right left :lol: :lol:
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I'm not sure if they replaced all the injectors or just the faulty ones. The report just said "swapped out faulty injectors" but didn't say how many! And yes, I did turn the wipers on and off instead of the indicators in the Getz! Not good because it was pi**ing down with rain while I was driving it home!
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I'm not sure if they replaced all the injectors or just the faulty ones. The report just said "swapped out faulty injectors" but didn't say how many! And yes, I did turn the wipers on and off instead of the indicators in the Getz! Not good because it was pi**ing down with rain while I was driving it home!
That is one of several reasons why I would have a Focus or Astra over here last time I drove one they were on the wrong side :fum:
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It's always a good thing to indicate to other drivers that it's raining though.
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Hi all, yes I have been otherwise occupied for the last month or more, but is did include a 2 week trip through the Kimberleys... Fantastic... :goodjob2:
Ok on this topic... my mate that just bought a diesel hatch... called me today and told me that his was making a "detonation" sound. done less than 8,000 KM..
To cut things short... he took it back to his dealer, they said that "yes , there have been some problems" and they will need to re-flash the computer.
First time it went through to the 50% download and literally " fried" the computer..
It was replaced and the flash done again.... got to 80% and FRIED the computer....thats 2 computers at $3500 each!! :scared:
As it stands they dont know why.... they have provided a replacement car... as my mates car is unable to be driven. In the meantime they are again scratching their heads !!!!
So.... I will report back when I have more news....cant offer any other solutions or possible causes other than what has already been posted...
Cheers
Tony
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I look forward to hearing about your trip, Tony... :goodjob:
As for the pooter....Flash - a-ah! (sung in my best queen voice) :faint: :whistler:
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Hi Tony, hope you are better than your mates car (and that things are going well for you)
That is a weird one :confused: :disapp:
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AFAIK Flashing the computer is only sending digital data to memory @ no more that 5v and miniscule current. You don't want any interruptions during this, so if there were sparks etc, then there is a serious wiring fault, or it wasn't connected properly, twice :scared:
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My CRDI has had this problem on & off for the past year. Started around 5000 km from new. I did put in an entry, but I can't find it now (silly old bugger, I know!!) claiming it sounded like a big end knock. The dealer had had the problem before & had a "fix" to flash the computer. That didn't last long & we have supposdly received a series of updates to the computer from the factory in Korea. Last time, 6 weeks ago, they said they were waiting on yet another fix. Will let you know if anything comes of it. Meanwhile we are driving around in a bucket of bolts, regretting the day we bought it.
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Seems weird as people like me had a Feb 2008 CRDi manual for 28 month and 68,000 kms and never went near the Dealer the whole time (so no ECU updates and no knocking)
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We've got 2008 & 2010 models, never a hint from either of them. Why would all these updates be necessary. No one else needs them. I think the dealer is wrong & I would try another if possible. :neutral:
Sorry you're not happy with your car.
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136,681 kms in an '09 diesel and never a hint of a problem so something doesn't sound right.
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At the end of June this year I bought a 2009 1.6 CRDi with 80,000 miles on it.
All was lovely until a couple of weeks ago when I suddenly noticed a diesel knocking noise too.
The mpg has taken a slight dip too.
It seems worse when cold or in the lower gears.
I guess I will need to get the injectors checked out?
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Diesel's always sound different at low revs due to the nature of their fuel ignition.
Unlike a petrol car, there is no flame front (or rapid burning) which originates from the spark plugs of petrol engines and travels through the fuel air mixture. In a Diesel, all the fuel ignites or detonates at the same instant due to the heating of the whole fuel air mix through compression. This happens at supersonic speed, which is the reason for the knock.
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If it's a rattle type noise at 1800rpm under light to medium load the reflash is probably the go.
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Believe everything said by Phil but
"This happens at supersonic speed, which is the reason for the knock"
The i30 is great but can they go that fast? :snigger:
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Petrol flame fronts that travel at supersonic speeds result in a detonation instead of rapid burning. Detonation in petrol engines destroys them, but NOT in Diesel engines, therefore the reaction is in fact supersonic. :mrgreen:
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Hi everyone, been an avid reader of the forum for a while but only just registered! I have a 2010 1.6 CRDi 115PS CW with 5400 miles on the clock. I have owned the car from new. When I bought the car I was so impressed by how refined the diesel engine was - the most un-diesel like diesel I had ever driven! After 5400 miles though I have a bit of a problem that came on suddenly. The engine now has a harsher tone to it, especially around 1500 RPM and when I pull away under load in 2nd or 3rd gear from around 1200 RPM there is a loud knocking sound (like pinking in a petrol car only louder) until the engine gets to around 2000 RPM. It sounds like fuel detonation at the wrong time and seems worse when the engine is hot. Even my wife noticed the difference in sound when she drove the car and she is not very mechanically minded - she said it sounded much louder, like an old style diesel! The car runs ok besides this and the fuel economy hasn't changed. I have checked the oil and water and they are fine. I have got the car booked in with Hyundai next week but I was interested to see if anyone else had seen this problem so I could be armed with more information when the car goes in! Thanks in advance to anyone who takes the time to reply!
I know this is quite an old thread, but just want to add I had the same problem magically appear in the last few weeks on my 1.6 CRDi Diesel Engine.
Took it into the dealer accompanied by a printout of posts from THIS thread showing solutions. They told me it needed the ECU update that was required on "one or two" i30s they had seen. Funny how when I collected the car the girl giving me my keys back asked the service guy what they had done under warranty, and his immediate reply was "the i30 ECU update" and she appeared to know exactly what he meant. Interesting...
The service guy told me the injectors were - at a certain load and rev range - squirting fuel at the incorrect time. I suppose the effect was like 'pre-ignition' in a petrol car. Regardless, my i30 is back to its usual noisy little self and grumbling along nicely.
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:Agoodpost:
:ta: for the update
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Well, I remember the old type diesel injectors. If the spring inside the injector was getting weak the injector would open too early and the too-early-injected diesel would create a sound like a little guy was inside the engine with a hammer.
It would sound like the engine was about to fall apart... :confused:
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Bitsumishi said
"They told me it needed the ECU update that was required on "one or two" i30s they had seen"
As a matter of interest does anyone know if these EMU updates (and others) are made available by Hyundai to independent mechanics or must we forever return to the Hyundai dealers for EMU programming and resetting.
I do not like being tied to Hyundai after the warranty period.
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AFAIK, not obligated in Oz, but in EU apparently, they are.
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Sounds to me like a fuel problem. I had trouble when my CRDI was at about 5000k, poor performance and rough noisy running at low revs. A bottle of Hyundai injector cleaner, a tank of quality fuel followed by a highway 200k trip fixed everything. Hy then changed the fuel filter just to be sure.
I now have over 60,000k and everything fine
Good luch
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I have the same issue... Had my injectors replaced, then ECU reflashed and it was gone for 2 thousand kms... Now it's back :-( service told me that it's computer that rejects software after / during adaptation and it needs to be replaced however my electronic checked it and it seems to be OK... Any ideas and hindsight?
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Hi, sorry can't really add anything to my earlier posts - the car has performed perfectly ever since the injectors were replaced. Now at around 28,000 miles and running great!
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Good for you - thanks for posting anyway!