i30 Owners Club
MODIFYING OR DETAILING YOUR I30 => SUSPENSION & STEERING => Topic started by: noels_hobby on July 07, 2011, 19:34:44
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:blubber:
greetings all ,
does any one know where to buy adjustable track rods for the rear suspension in Australia ?
my i30 sx crdi 2010 model, stock, is scalloping rear tyres due to the camber angles
tyres replaced at 28000 km/s excessive wear on inside edge even after 2 dealer wheel alignments with settings to Hyundai factory specs
cheers noel
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Personally, I would be demanding Hyundai fix the problem and at least do a pro rata on the tyres.....
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Welcome Noel ...Sorry to hear about your tyre issue .. Unfortunately, I cant help with your query. :-[
It is a stange one because there have been a few recent report of excessive (uneven) tyre wear particularly on the diesel but I thought it was more the fronts (related maybe to the extra engine weight effecting the front suspension) :undecided:
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welcome noel. :razz: the adjustable arms you asked about can be purchased from a company here in Australia called ultra racing. :cool: :goodjob:
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Welcome Noel ...Sorry to hear about your tyre issue .. Unfortunately, I cant help with your query. :-[
It is a stange one because there have been a few recent report of excessive (uneven) tyre wear particularly on the diesel but I thought it was more the fronts (related maybe to the extra engine weight effecting the front suspension) :undecided:
thanks to everyone for the responses
for those who can understand what all these numbers mean, the alignment readings before tyre company alignment
front toe L -0.1mm R -1.4mm camber L -00 49' R +00 26' steering pulling left
rear toe L +0.4mm R +0.0mm camber L -01 51' R -01 38'
note these readings were apparently with in factory spec all 4 tyres had scalloping on the inside at 28000 km, the tyres were not sitting flat on the road the weight was on the inside, the vehicle became noisy to drive sounded like a hilux with chunky off road tyres
after tyre company alignment
front toe L+0.2mm R+0.2mm camber L-01 04' R-00 04' steering dead straight
rear toe L+1.0mm R+1.0mm camber L-01 07' R-01 10'
set back +00 29'
track diference 00 17'
tyre co fella reckons the camber front left is out of spec and not adjustable the rear is in spec but an overkill for the weight of the car, camber adjustments would be an advantage thus why i am seeking adjustable trailing rods for rear. have not been able to find any information on a mod for the front apart from an article on converting the suspension of an i30 crdi for use as a rally car they increased the clearance height of the car by 11/2 inches changed the shock tower assembly and springs this altered the pre set front camber.
cheers noel
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have a look on the pedders suspension site noel. there are eccentric bolts that get put in the strut where it bolts to the steering knuckle that will give you adjustable camber. :goodjob:
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went up to pedders
15mm eccentric bolts in the bottom of the front struts should do the trick $150
put them on order, go back next week
cheers noel
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:goodjob: :mrgreen:
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went up to pedders
15mm eccentric bolts in the bottom of the front struts should do the trick $150
put them on order, go back next week
cheers noel
Expensive bolts :wacko:
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All,
Evidently this is a prevalent issue for the I30. BUT, I discovered Shark Racing
offers a sweet set of adjustable rear trailing arms. I found them in a hurry after being advised of the issue in my Touring (I30) here in the U.S. They were shipped out of Korea and arrived quickly, shipping included. The link is:
http://www.sharkracing.com/acecart/bin/shop.cgi?action=view&itemID=trailingarm_1&cate=011900000 (http://www.sharkracing.com/acecart/bin/shop.cgi?action=view&itemID=trailingarm_1&cate=011900000)
Hope this helps! Give me a holler if the link doesn't work for you.
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Welcome to the club and thanks for the link.. :goodjob:
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:goodjob2: :razz:
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just noticed post on tyre wear my 2ltre diesil crdi has only done about 12,000 miles on a set of kumho fronts wear on inside and a bit of life left yet but changed them anyway before winter this is a bit excessive ,aggressive driving does not help but rears are still origional with plenty tread left at 33,000 miles
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All,
Evidently this is a prevalent issue for the I30. BUT, I discovered Shark Racing
offers a sweet set of adjustable rear trailing arms. I found them in a hurry after being advised of the issue in my Touring (I30) here in the U.S. They were shipped out of Korea and arrived quickly, shipping included. The link is:
Just revisiting this thread it is interesting that the 2.0 touring in the USA has a similar issue..
Looks like there may be two issues as others seem to suspect the weight of the diesel engine may cause sagging in the front suspension leading to premature front tryre wear when the mileage gets up a bit :undecided:
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remember to rotate the tyres at 5000 kms can help. :idea:
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I'll second the notion that the 2.0 Petrol has at least a similar issue. The front tires seem to have no issues, the rear however are another story. I have noticed that the inside edges of the rear tires had been worn away slightly faster than the rest of the tires. Even though it's just the outside edge it's still just as bad. Once those shoulder treads are gone I'm going to need new tires. No sense having tread for going straight but not around corners. I've already mentioned something to my local Hyundai service rep. I was assured there are no alignment/suspensin problems on the car. :whistler: Typical. Now that I know others are having the problem, I'm going to keep a close eye on my treadwear, and a closer eye on my Hyundai dealership. :twisted:
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I don't know, but I would have the wheel geometry checked in cases like that - by someone else. When I bought Accent, the geometry was off (from day 1) and similar with the Santa Fe. They might say it's okay, but obviously it's not?
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i30RWAB, just refresh my memory. How many klms has your car done since new?
Are they the original tyres?
Do you know FOR CERTAIN they have not been rotated front to rear? Because if they have, the alignment problem causing the uneven wear is at the front.
Have you had an independent alignment check since your accident? If something isn't right from that, it wouldn't take long to wreck the tyres.
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Dazzler,
You say it is an issue for high km cars, but all the cars in this post seem to have low k's
I have done 43k in my CW and the only issue with my tyres is that they are running out of tread.
Will be interesting to see what happens once I double that though.
Would be a shame if it does start to chew the tyres.....but I don't think I have heard any of the +100k people mention it (though my memory may be failing me)
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Dazzler,
You say it is an issue for high km cars, but all the cars in this post seem to have low k's
I have done 43k in my CW and the only issue with my tyres is that they are running out of tread.
Will be interesting to see what happens once I double that though.
Would be a shame if it does start to chew the tyres.....but I don't think I have heard any of the +100k people mention it (though my memory may be failing me)
Beerman and dazzler,
It's not uncommon for vehicles with a few k's on them to end up wearing tyres unevenly due to the fact that often the cars aren't checked for alignment with any regularity. It's a simple process to check and adjust the front and rear alignment but most don't do it. Or they depend on the dealer to do it.
I know for sure that many (not all ) car dealers subby out their alignments even though they often have the equipment themselves. And if you are doing a "Trade" alignment, it's not always going to have as much attention paid to it as to one where you are going to eyeball the driver when he/she picks it up.
Also, communication breaks down with an extra link in the chain. We were involved in one a while back on a Nissan X-Trail which had "issues". We told the owner about it and as she lived up here (we were working on it in Brisbane), she took it back to her local Nissan dealer. There was a problem which really went back to the factory. Anyway, the Nissan dealer subby'd it out to the Beaurepaires over the road then told her everything was OK and obviously we didn't know what we were doing.
When I got onto the Beauepaires manager he showed me the job card with its large notes back to the Nissan dealer explaining what was wrong and it was not adjustable and had no doubt caome from the factory like that.
Luckily in this case we were dealing with an efficient wheel aligner who kept proper records and was happy to discuss it with me.
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and a bloke who cares enough to follow up.....which is rare these days
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Surferdude,
Sorry for the long wait, but things have been a little crazy for me. I bought the car with 14,400 miles on it. Now it has almost 27,000. We bought the car in May of this year. Right after the accident the alignment was checked and found to be way out, so all tires were rotated and the alignment was performed. I got a chance to look at the spec sheet afterwards and was pleased with the numbers there. Everything was reported to be in the "acceptable" parameters established by Hyundai. Since the alignment I have been keeping tabs on my tires and have found that the rear tires continue to degrade on the inner shoulder only. The alignment was done by Hyundai at the request of the body shop which fixed the car. It just happened to be next to the dealership :P I think perhaps it's simply time to cal the insurance company AGAIN, and let them know that the car still isn't right. Also the tires on the car when purchased were the original units and they showed almost no wear. Undoubtedly the accident has affected something which has not been repaired or correctly addressed. But I'm still stuck on the point that Hyundai tells me all wheels are aligned within their specifications, yet my tires still suffer. :faint:
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:blubber:
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Surferdude,
Sorry for the long wait, but things have been a little crazy for me. I bought the car with 14,400 miles on it. Now it has almost 27,000. We bought the car in May of this year. Right after the accident the alignment was checked and found to be way out, so all tires were rotated and the alignment was performed. I got a chance to look at the spec sheet afterwards and was pleased with the numbers there. Everything was reported to be in the "acceptable" parameters established by Hyundai. Since the alignment I have been keeping tabs on my tires and have found that the rear tires continue to degrade on the inner shoulder only. The alignment was done by Hyundai at the request of the body shop which fixed the car. It just happened to be next to the dealership :P I think perhaps it's simply time to cal the insurance company AGAIN, and let them know that the car still isn't right. Also the tires on the car when purchased were the original units and they showed almost no wear. Undoubtedly the accident has affected something which has not been repaired or correctly addressed. But I'm still stuck on the point that Hyundai tells me all wheels are aligned within their specifications, yet my tires still suffer. :faint:
OK. I think you probably should try to find a reputable independent aligner and pay for an alignment check and get the printout. If it's correct, at least you know the Hyundai/repairer was right.
If it's not, you have something to go on.
One other thing. How much weight of your cleaning materials do you carry in the back? Is it possible they are having an effect on how the car is sitting at the back? Don't reject this one out of hand just because the tyres appeared to be wearing OK beofre the accident. It is possible they were doing it all along but the wear only becomes apparent to the casual observer when it gets close to the indicators.
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Surferdude,
Before we began using the car for work we removed the rear seat. This assembly probably weighed about 75 pounds or so. The combined weight of what we carry is probably close to 200 pounds. This shouldn't have a negative affect on the tires, at least I hope!!
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Surferdude,
Before we began using the car for work we removed the rear seat. This assembly probably weighed about 75 pounds or so. The combined weight of what we carry is probably close to 200 pounds. This shouldn't have a negative affect on the tires, at least I hope!!
True. I'd forgotten you took the rear seat out. I agree it shouldn't have an effect, however I'd still get an independent alignment check - preferably with your work gear in place. We often do that with tradesmen's vehicles. They'll unload them and come in for an alignment but we ask them to load it up as it will be for most of the week and make the settings accordingly.
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You make great sense. In the long run I suppose it would be worth the fifty dollars to get it checked out. That's still a lot less than two new shoes! Thanks for all of your insights, much obliged!! :)
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Is there anyone with a crdi that's done reasonable km that does not have the tyre wear issues or is this turning out to be one of the possible inherent problems with the crdi like the headlight blowing issues.
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I've had 3 goes at replying to this but I keep getting the error message. I guess because I've changed the content each time I haven't been locked ou (yet).
But I'll come back to it later and try another text version
:twisted: :evil:
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That's funny, sending a message that you can't send a message. :rofl:
We got your explanation about being unable to reply, so I guess you can reply now. :mrgreen:
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That's funny, sending a message that you can't send a message. :rofl:
We got your explanation about being unable to reply, so I guess you can reply now. :mrgreen:
:P :P
I tried to answer the post with three different versions of text. Each time I got the white screen warning (if you haven't seen it yet, you will one day).
So i changed the words around but the only one which it let me send through was the one above. :mrgreen:
I was hoping that crdi owners with high mileage will see this and give us some feedbak.
I also made the point that, the only way to address this is to monitor the tyre wear reagularly from the time they are fitted. That's time consuming but an interesting exercise.
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^^
Wow. It let me through.
I have no idea what combination of words I used before which were classed as "spam" but obviously I eventually got an acceptable variation. :cool:
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I've had 3 goes at replying to this but I keep getting the error message...
While we're here... avoid using the word "select" or derivatives like selection, selected etc as you'll more than likely get hit.
(quote my post to see how I get round this problem. I got hit during the week but only sent the text once (it was in a PM) so I knew I had to adjust the content)
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Is there anyone with a crdi that's done reasonable km that does not have the tyre wear issues or is this turning out to be one of the possible inherent problems with the crdi like the headlight blowing issues.
My 2008 CRDi did about 70 000 km on the original Hankooks and the wear on them was fairly even.
I replaced them with Pirelli P7 tyres and, with the odometer now reading just over 100 000 km, they
seem to have been a good selection as they are wearing very well and very evenly.
Russ
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My 2008 CRDi did about 70 000 km on the original Hankooks and the wear on them was fairly even.
I replaced them with Pirelli P7 tyres and, with the odometer now reading just over 100 000 km, they
seem to have been a good selection as they are wearing very well and very evenly.
Russ
Great to hear. At least I can keep my fingers crossed mine is the same.
I purposely bought the i30 late within its life cycle in the hope that bugs would be sorted out. It's disconcerting reading about things such as the headlight blowing in the crdi 3 years after the model was introduced in 2011 models. It kind of suggests they still don't know what the cause is. I hope this tyre wear thing is not the same.
For the car to the wearing the inner shoulder of tyres and for hyundai to say there is nothing wrong with the alignment makes me worry.
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I've had 3 goes at replying to this but I keep getting the error message...
While we're here... avoid using the word "select" or derivatives like selection, selected etc as you'll more than likely get hit.
(quote my post to see how I get round this problem. I got hit during the week but only sent the text once (it was in a PM) so I knew I had to adjust the content)
Thanks for that info Steve.
"Quoting" your post doesn't show anything different on the word select, though.
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Thanks for that info Steve.
"Quoting" your post doesn't show anything different on the word select, though.
It's a wonder you got away with that one ... Steve used bold within THE word to get around it if you have a look when you quote him.. :winker:
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Thanks for that info Steve.
"Quoting" your post doesn't show anything different on the word select, though.
It's a wonder you got away with that one ... Steve used bold within THE word to get around it if you have a look when you quote him.. :winker:
Dazz,
I know that trick. It is used regularly to get around swear filters.
But when I "quoted" Steve, it didn''t (and doesn't) show up the way it does on other sites. And when I tried to bold in th emiddle of the word it didn't show up as there either.
Anyway, as you say. Lucky to get away with it I guess.
But I still don't know why the "bold" isn't showing up.
This is what I expected to see.
crap
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Thanks for that info Steve.
"Quoting" your post doesn't show anything different on the word select, though.
It's a wonder you got away with that one ... Steve used bold within THE word to get around it if you have a look when you quote him.. :winker:
Dazz,
I know that trick. It is used regularly to get around swear filters.
But when I "quoted" Steve, it didn''t (and doesn't) show up the way it does on other sites. And when I tried to bold in th emiddle of the word it didn't show up as there either.
Anyway, as you say. Lucky to get away with it I guess.
But I still don't know why the "bold" isn't showing up.
This is what I expected to see.
crap
Well, that didn't work either.
I give up. I'm cutting and pasting - doen't work. I'm entering the square brackets with the keyboard and they still don't show up.
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That is real strange Trev when I quote steve then went in to add to the reply it was there as plain as day :confused:
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That is real strange Trev when I quote steve then went in to add to the reply it was there as plain as day :confused:
I though BBCode might be turned off but I can't even find where to check.
Let me try some things
sqare opening bracket [
square closing bracket ]
lower case "b" b
Forward slash /
Just previewed - they're all there.
Now if I combine them like this
noo result - I just entered them, key stroke by key stroke in the "bolding" sequence and they don't show up.
Anyway, we're off topic here. Sorry.
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My diesel did 68,000 kms on first set of Kumhos, no problem, but the second set started to wear prematurely on the front. The rears were still looking like new.
Tyres were rotated, have now done 106,000 kms, still the front wearing the insides, rear ok.
Tyre place suggested the weight of the diesel engine as front suspension became worn as likely cause but nothing proven.
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My diesel did 68,000 kms on first set of Kumhos, no problem, but the second set started to wear prematurely on the front. The rears were still looking like new.
Tyres were rotated, have now done 106,000 kms, still the front wearing the insides, rear ok.
Tyre place suggested the weight of the diesel engine as front suspension became worn as likely cause but nothing proven.
I wonder how other car makers manage to deal with this situation?
Is it restricted to diesel? Other cars' suspensions must also get worn but the past few I've had (albeit petrol) have not worn out the 2nd set of tyres differently to the first.
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My diesel did 68,000 kms on first set of Kumhos, no problem, but the second set started to wear prematurely on the front. The rears were still looking like new.
Tyres were rotated, have now done 106,000 kms, still the front wearing the insides, rear ok.
Tyre place suggested the weight of the diesel engine as front suspension became worn as likely cause but nothing proven.
I wonder how other car makers manage to deal with this situation?
Is it restricted to diesel? Other cars' suspensions must also get worn but the past few I've had (albeit petrol) have not worn out the 2nd set of tyres differently to the first.
Fair comment.
Let's be honest about it, 100,000 klms ain't much really in this day and age.
The bushes might get a bit soft but that will allow a minimal amount of movement not the fairly big slip to cause a toe out or negative camber problem.
The shocks might get a bit softer (at 100,000 klm they are getting towards the end of their most effective life - but are probably good for another 100k unless they develop leaks.
And th esprings might droop a little bit but surely someone could check the ride height to establish this. A combination of all three in my opinion might cause excess tyre wear compared to the first set but it would generally be even across the tread face. And in my experience, only worth about 10 or 15% difference in mileage.
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But Trev, what other explanation could there be?.. It seems to be the front of the diesel that we are getting feedback on (mainly) with this issue...I wouldn't call it a major problem yet but still a bit of a worry. :confused:
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But Trev, what other explanation could there be?.. It seems to be the front of the diesel that we are getting feedback on (mainly) with this issue...I wouldn't call it a major problem yet but still a bit of a worry. :confused:
Got me. :undecided: I'm following this with interest. Anything I've posted above is really just thinking out loud.
However, if they are wearing unevely, there has to be a reason which should be fairly obvious to an experienced wheel aligner, with the car in front of him. I should add that I'm no longer an experienced wheel aligner (if I ever was :-[ )but the process of diagnosis is, or should be fairly straightforward.
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I might have to start a thread at some time inviting those few with the problem to post their experiences and we can do some brainstorming... :confused:
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I might have to start a thread at some time inviting those few with the problem to post their experiences and we can do some brainstorming... :confused:
Good idea.
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Can I ask if higher tyre pressures eg 38 psi could contribute to increased suspension wear and eventually lead to what we are discussing here.
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Gee Con.. I would be surprised if Trev thinks that could be a contributing factor :eek:
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Can I ask if higher tyre pressures eg 38 psi could contribute to increased suspension wear and eventually lead to what we are discussing here.
Fair question given some of the discussions which have been going on here. All I can say is, I've never seen any evidence of it in other cars. And whilst we might agree that the diesel i30 engine puts undue stress on the front suspension, I would be prepared to bet that the weight versus suspension strength of the i30 has been replicated in the past without causing any issues.
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We are only talking a difference in weight of 30-40kg here, depending on the model.... :undecided:
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I might have to start a thread at some time inviting those few with the problem to post their experiences and we can do some brainstorming... :confused:
Great idea
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here's a little trick to try when getting a wheel alignment done. :idea: if your getting a 4 wheel alignment ,make sure you have a full tank of fuel. if its done with an almost empty tank your going to have a massive amount of toe out when you fill up your tank next,hence the scrubbing out the inside edges of your rear tyres. :winker: whats your thoughts on this Trev?
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here's a little trick to try when getting a wheel alignment done. :idea: if your getting a 4 wheel alignment ,make sure you have a full tank of fuel. if its done with an almost empty tank your going to have a massive amount of toe out when you fill up your tank next,hence the scrubbing out the inside edges of your rear tyres. :winker: whats your thoughts on this Trev?
I've commented somewhere about how important it is particularly with tradies to align the vehicle with the "usual" amount of weight it carries.
haven't thought about this before but now that you mention it, maybe do the alignment with a half tank, so there would be as little change as possible between full and empty. If that makes sense?
Or align it with a full tank and don't let it get below half before you re-fill.
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:goodjob2: :goodjob:
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Just changed from winter to summertyres. The wintertyres on the rear axle did not look great.
Now I'm not so happy. Ok, the tyres wasn't new when I mounted them, but they were not blank on the shoulder, or near blank, I have done about 9000 km on the wintertyres. The wear you can see is on the inner shoulder.
(http://i1056.photobucket.com/albums/t370/Rasnik-1/Wheeli302.jpg)
I did have a 4 wheel alignment test when I bought the car 12 month ago, and the rear camber is out of spec. According to Hyundai camber is not adjustable on rear axle, so I wanted to see how things went on.
I do about 25-27.000 km a year. Approx 15.000 of them is with 4 people in the car, when going for work, another 5.000 is with caravan.
Spec is - 1º 39' --> - 0º 39' but as you can see they are - 1º 54' and - 1º 55' ( red in the middle of the pic )
(http://i1056.photobucket.com/albums/t370/Rasnik-1/Wheeli304.jpg)
Did any of you guys have any luck to adjust camber on rear axle to factory settings after buying some of those adjustable rods or excentric bolts... :question:
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^^^
I'll let the guys who have fitted those adjustment reply in due course but I just have one observation here.
There's a possibility that having 4 people in the car as much as you do, plus towing the 'van may have contributed to that wear. I know the car is capabl eof doing both those things but I suspect (only "suspect") that the designers take into account the most common useage of a vehicle when designing it. Hence, a car like the i30 is probably expected to be a 1 or 2 person car for the majority of the time and towing would probably be expected to be less than in your case.
So, spring rates, shockabsorber settings, camber settings etc. would be designed for optimum results with mostly 2 people in the car.
All of this is why there is such an industry built up around modifying suspension for caravanners etc.
Essentially, your car is going to spend a lot more time at the bottom end of its rear suspension travel where the settings will be slightly different.
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I think you're partly right.
Towing caravan is not done with the wintertyres, and the summertyres just mounted, has even wear all 4. (12.000 km since new)
The way the rear suspension is designed I guess the negative camber will increase when putting load in the car.
Maybe I should see if I could have the car adjusted with the load of 4 persons in it.. :question:
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I think you're partly right.
Towing caravan is not done with the wintertyres, and the summertyres just mounted, has even wear all 4. (12.000 km since new)
The way the rear suspension is designed I guess the negative camber will increase when putting load in the car.
Maybe I should see if I could have the car adjusted with the load of 4 persons in it.. :question:
Yep maybe so.
You just need a good aligner who understands what you are trying to achieve, tyre wear wise.
But if the summer tyres are wearing OK, maybe you should leave it. Can you post a pic on here of them (the rears)?
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Pics will have to wait until tomorrow, it's allmost midnight here now.
I did measure the tread after dismantling them, it was 5,5 mm all over, but I will take pic's tomorrow.
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As you can see here, the company Shark racing supplies adjustable rods for the rear camber, but they are at 180 USD.
I was thinking uncrewing the bolt between the suspension frame and the lower arm (under the spring), then make the hole in the suspension frame wider, to allow the bolt to adjust horizontal, that would make me able to adjust the camber, right.. :question:
(http://i1056.photobucket.com/albums/t370/Rasnik-1/trailingarm_1_trailingarm.jpg)
(http://i1056.photobucket.com/albums/t370/Rasnik-1/trailingarm_1_trailingarm2.jpg)
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Yes it would but it's almost impossible to tighten it enough so it won't slip (move) under load, thus making your adjustment problems even worse.
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I'm afraid you're right :disapp:
Here a pic of the summertyre on the right rear:
(http://i1056.photobucket.com/albums/t370/Rasnik-1/rear-right1.jpg)
I just measured the rear wheels today with the spirit leveler ( is it really the right word ? )
At the bottom the leveler was set against the tyre.
On right wheel there is 17 mm at the top of the tyre. The leveler is actually level vertical with the wheel arch.
(http://i1056.photobucket.com/albums/t370/Rasnik-1/rear-right2.jpg)
(http://i1056.photobucket.com/albums/t370/Rasnik-1/rear-right3.jpg)
(http://i1056.photobucket.com/albums/t370/Rasnik-1/rear-right4.jpg)
But on the left side the leveler is approx 10 mm from the arch when level vertical, and the space between leveler and tyre is here 23 mm.
(http://i1056.photobucket.com/albums/t370/Rasnik-1/rear-left1.jpg)
(http://i1056.photobucket.com/albums/t370/Rasnik-1/rear-left2.jpg)
There's something wrong here.. :undecided:
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Asterix
This is off topic - for which I apologise - but is your car fitted with Continental Premium Contact tyres - the tread pattern looks similar. If so - how do you find them for cabin noise?
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Asterix
This is off topic - for which I apologise - but is your car fitted with Continental Premium Contact tyres - the tread pattern looks similar. If so - how do you find them for cabin noise?
Hi Alan
No apology needed. Yes, it is Conti P C 2.
They are ok, very similar, noisewise, to the Pirelli P6000 fitted when I bought the car, but I think the bad alignment of the rear provides more noise than normal, even though there's no heel and toe.
In general there's to much roadnoise in the car, but that's another issue.
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I've never seen measuring like that done before Asterix although I can see what you're trying to do.
But there could be marginal differences in the panels or their mounting from one side to the other.
Was one of your winter tyres worn more than the other?
I had those Contis on a hire car in the UK a coupl eof years ago and found them very quiet, so much so that I commented on them at the time. The pattern is not unlike my Duraplus.
And yes, it's a "spirit level". The bubble is in some form of spirit (ethanol or alcohol etc).
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I've never seen measuring like that done before Asterix although I can see what you're trying to do.
I've never done this kind of measuring before, but I've also not had a car before with this issue.
On my 1993 Nissan primera both camber an toe is adjustable, so no problem.
But there could be marginal differences in the panels or their mounting from one side to the other.
Yes, but I'm a little surprised that it would be so significant. But, I have nothing to compare with.
Was one of your winter tyres worn more than the other?
The rear left had more even wear, which surprises me, as the camber is the same for left and right.
I might just go to the tyrecenter to have another alignment done, to see if anything have changed.
Will you agree with me, if I state that more load in the car creates more negative camber.. :question:
The Conti tyres did get good result for noise in some test I saw some time ago, but I also got very nice feedback from costumers when I worked at a VW dealer. That's the main reason for buying them.
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I've never seen measuring like that done before Asterix although I can see what you're trying to do.
But there could be marginal differences in the panels or their mounting from one side to the other.
Panels? The measurement is taken from the Spirit level to the tyre sidewall, so who cares about the panels. ;)
As far as the adjustable rods are concerned, yes they are expensive but so are 2 rear tyres that have worn unevenly and have to be tossed away. I believe your concern is when towing & 4 adults in the car, so if you got the adjustable rods, how would they be adjusted for this type of weight situation and what would happen when you're not towing or driving with less people, to me it's always going to involve some form of compromise. :neutral:
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I've never seen measuring like that done before Asterix although I can see what you're trying to do.
But there could be marginal differences in the panels or their mounting from one side to the other.
Panels? The measurement is taken from the Spirit level to the tyre sidewall, so who cares about the panels. ;)
As far as the adjustable rods are concerned, yes they are expensive but so are 2 rear tyres that have worn unevenly and have to be tossed away. I believe your concern is when towing & 4 adults in the car, so if you got the adjustable rods, how would they be adjusted for this type of weight situation and what would happen when you're not towing or driving with less people, to me it's always going to involve some form of compromise. :neutral:
Well, the manufacturer allways state that alignment should be carried out at empty car, but I might just try to have the alignment done with some weight in the car to make e.g 3 persons be "standard"
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How much weight does your van place on the rear suspension Asterix & do you have those caravan levelling spring things fitted to your caravan A frame :question:
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How much weight does your van place on the rear suspension Asterix & do you have those caravan levelling spring things fitted to your caravan A frame :question:
I only have 60 kg on the towball.
Levelling springs on A frame.. :question: :question:
None of the km's on the wintertyres are with the caravan.
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do you have those caravan levelling spring things fitted to your caravan A frame :question:
Have a look at this, do you have them in your country :question:
http://www.hardingscaravans.com.au/preparing-to-tow-distributing-hitch.htm (http://www.hardingscaravans.com.au/preparing-to-tow-distributing-hitch.htm)
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I've never seen measuring like that done before Asterix although I can see what you're trying to do.
But there could be marginal differences in the panels or their mounting from one side to the other.
Panels? The measurement is taken from the Spirit level to the tyre sidewall, so who cares about the panels. ;)
Yeah. Sorry. I should have put my glasses on to look more closely at the pics. However, Asterix makes the point that there is a diference from one side to the other but the rear camber settings are the same on both sides. Assuming the alignment settings are correct I can only assume there is some small difference in the way the spirit level is being read. It's not possible to be sure the ground is level, the car is level and the spirit level is totally accurate on both sides. To explain those a bit, a minor dip in the road surface would be enough to put the comparison between two side out. The car on an alignment machine sits (or should) on turntables on rollers which ensure the suspension is settled evenly on both sides. The bubble in the spirit level, especially in a vertical position is only positioned by eye. And if that was accurate enough there would be no need for a wheel alignment machine.
The car is sitting on what appear to me to be pavers not a level slab of concrete (but I might be wrong). And looking at the wall in front of the car (again, it's hard to tell) but it appears to be on a light slope where the floor butts up to it.
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How much weight does your van place on the rear suspension Asterix & do you have those caravan levelling spring things fitted to your caravan A frame :question:
I only have 60 kg on the towball.
Levelling springs on A frame.. :question: :question:
None of the km's on the wintertyres are with the caravan.
The levelling springs help. But 60kg at the drawbar is only what it is at rest. So Acceleration, braking and dips in the road all magnify this figure or reduce it.
Although the handbooks generally say set alignments with the car empty, I know from personal experience that this is not necessarily going to give the best result. I would be inclined to pay a bit extra and take readings with two people in the car and again with four, just to see how much if any, difference it makes. If there is no difference then that's good. If there is some, a good alignment operator will have some idea what allowance to make to optimise the wear (it probably can't be eliminated).
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I believe your concern is when towing & 4 adults in the car, so if you got the adjustable rods, how would they be adjusted for this type of weight situation and what would happen when you're not towing or driving with less people, to me it's always going to involve some form of compromise. :neutral:
This is a good point. Even if you have the adjustment option, it's not necessarily going to fix the problem, although it might move the wear issue to the outside shoulders, depending on when you are travelling loaded or not.
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Good comments, as usual surferdude :goodjob2:
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do you have those caravan levelling spring things fitted to your caravan A frame :question:
Have a look at this, do you have them in your country :question:
http://www.hardingscaravans.com.au/preparing-to-tow-distributing-hitch.htm (http://www.hardingscaravans.com.au/preparing-to-tow-distributing-hitch.htm)
I've never seen or heard of these, will try to search the web. Maybe they are not approved in DK/EU.. :question:
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I've never seen measuring like that done before Asterix although I can see what you're trying to do.
But there could be marginal differences in the panels or their mounting from one side to the other.
Panels? The measurement is taken from the Spirit level to the tyre sidewall, so who cares about the panels. ;)
Yeah. Sorry. I should have put my glasses on to look more closely at the pics. However, Asterix makes the point that there is a diference from one side to the other but the rear camber settings are the same on both sides. Assuming the alignment settings are correct I can only assume there is some small difference in the way the spirit level is being read. It's not possible to be sure the ground is level, the car is level and the spirit level is totally accurate on both sides. To explain those a bit, a minor dip in the road surface would be enough to put the comparison between two side out. The car on an alignment machine sits (or should) on turntables on rollers which ensure the suspension is settled evenly on both sides. The bubble in the spirit level, especially in a vertical position is only positioned by eye. And if that was accurate enough there would be no need for a wheel alignment machine.
The car is sitting on what appear to me to be pavers not a level slab of concrete (but I might be wrong). And looking at the wall in front of the car (again, it's hard to tell) but it appears to be on a light slope where the floor butts up to it.
You're right.
It is pavers, and they are not 100% level, and the driveway has an incline, so I know the readings is not accurate, but they give a good hint.
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How much weight does your van place on the rear suspension Asterix & do you have those caravan levelling spring things fitted to your caravan A frame :question:
I only have 60 kg on the towball.
Levelling springs on A frame.. :question: :question:
None of the km's on the wintertyres are with the caravan.
The levelling springs help. But 60kg at the drawbar is only what it is at rest. So Acceleration, braking and dips in the road all magnify this figure or reduce it.
Yes, but I expect the manufacturer, Hyundai, to have taken that into considderation.
DK law states that weight on the towball must be min. 4% of weight towed, in my case 1400x0,04=56kg, which is very fine as I have 60-65 kg on the towball. Max weight on towball is BTW 70 or 75 kg, can't remember.
BUT, I must say, I don't think the caravan is the problem, as I havent towed the caravan with the wintertyres.
How much weight does your van place on the rear suspension Asterix & do you have those caravan levelling spring things fitted to your caravan A frame :question:
I only have 60 kg on the towball.
Levelling springs on A frame.. :question: :question:
None of the km's on the wintertyres are with the caravan.
Although the handbooks generally say set alignments with the car empty, I know from personal experience that this is not necessarily going to give the best result. I would be inclined to pay a bit extra and take readings with two people in the car and again with four, just to see how much if any, difference it makes. If there is no difference then that's good. If there is some, a good alignment operator will have some idea what allowance to make to optimise the wear (it probably can't be eliminated).
I will try to get a new alignment, first with empty car, then with some weight in it, it would be nice to see the difference.
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This is a good point. Even if you have the adjustment option, it's not necessarily going to fix the problem, although it might move the wear issue to the outside shoulders, depending on when you are travelling loaded or not.
Agree, but if I can have the camber adjusted I might get even wear.
This pic taken today after a short trip. The dirt on the tyre is all the way out to the inside of the tyre, but not all the way out to the outside.
i think it would help a lot if I could get the wear all over the tyre.
(http://i1056.photobucket.com/albums/t370/Rasnik-1/fratlf030412005.jpg)
I want to thank you both for your comments, it's much appreciated. :goodjob2:
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I hope you investigate the ride leveler springs, they allow weight to be transferred to the driving wheels of the car. Do you have any problems with night vision and the lights pointing up to the treetops instead of on the road. The springs are extremely popular here, my friend had them fitted and says they make a huge difference to the handling of the car / van too.
The most respected brand here in Oz for towbars is Hayman Reese. Use the advantage of the internet and have a chat with them. :neutral:
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I hope you investigate the ride leveler springs, they allow weight to be transferred to the driving wheels of the car. Do you have any problems with night vision and the lights pointing up to the treetops instead of on the road. The springs are extremely popular here, my friend had them fitted and says they make a huge difference to the handling of the car / van too.
The most respected brand here in Oz for towbars is Hayman Reese. Use the advantage of the internet and have a chat with them. :neutral:
I will look around for the leveler springs, will also post a ? at a Danish camping forum to see if anybody have heard of it.
I have no problems with lights in the treetops, as the car is equipped with electric height adjustment of the headlights.
I allways adjust to lowest setting when driving with the caravan, day or night, as we must have daytime running light here in DK. The low beam is the DRL on the i30, here in DK, anyway.
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Just ask Princess Mary, she would have seen them in use in Tassie. :mrgreen: