i30 Owners Club
GOT PROBLEMS OR ISSUES? => DIESEL => Topic started by: mick 62 on November 11, 2014, 00:21:08
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Hi all ,have been meaning to join this forum for some time but after recent events feel I have something of general interest. I own a 2010 I30 diesel which has been a great car up till a month ago when the turbo disintegrated & did enough damage to ruin the engine as well. The engine had 113,900 km on it & has 7 months left of the 5 year warranty.It has always been serviced on time with genuine parts & synthetic oils. I have had it serviced by a licensed motor mechanic friend who signed off all the services, stating what fluids & filters were changed. Of course Hyundai is using every excuse under the sun to claim the warranty is void- hence the current involvement of the department of fair trading. That's my problem.......my question is are there any other cases out there with a similar catastrophic event that occurred with no warning?
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:welcum: Mick
Sorry to hear about your tail of woe.. Catastrophic Turbo failure is pretty well unheard of on here..
Hopefully with the support of your mechanic you will get a positive result. :fingers:
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Sorry to hear about your problem there mick 62 :disapp:
What are Hyundai exactly saying has voided your warranty? I'm wondering if it's the oil filter as I was warned prior to my first service by the service manager that Hyundai are very strict against the use of 3rd party oil filters.
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Bad news indeed, sorry to hear this, but it does add weight to the fact that servicing outside the Hy dealerships opens a can of worms which you wouldn't have to deal with, had you stayed with the OEM. Secondly, you have an additional complication if using a 3rd party filter. Hy may determine that the filter caused your problem and the warranty should be sought from the filter manufacturer, good luck with that. :fum:
As I said, really sorry but I use Hy for servicing and HY parts, which I buy cheaper than HY charge for this very reason.
Good luck.
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Bad news indeed, sorry to hear this, but it does add weight to the fact that servicing outside the Hy dealerships opens a can of worms which you wouldn't have to deal with, had you stayed with the OEM. Secondly, you have an additional complication if using a 3rd party filter. Hy may determine that the filter caused your problem and the warranty should be sought from the filter manufacturer, good luck with that. :fum:
As I said, really sorry but I use Hy for servicing and HY parts, which I buy cheaper than HY charge for this very reason.
Good luck.
Phil, Mick said genuine parts..... You are entitled to use a non Hyundai service centre.. hope you win Mick.. :goodjob:
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:wttc:
Welcome Mick.
I agree with Dazz. I hope you win if everything has been done by the book.
It is perfectly legal to use a third party accredited mechanic.
If the filter turns out to be the issue, I would expect the filter manufacturer to assist you.
I wonder where Hyundai get their filters from. :undecided:
As I understand it, some after market filters exceed manufacturers specifications anyway.
After all, Hyundai use their warranty to sell the car so they should stand by it IMO.
One of the main reasons I chose to leave Hyundai as far as the servicing is concerned was that the dealership service manager couldn't even tell me what oil they used.
Plus the fact that they change brands whenever they get a better deal for themselves.
I prefer to have my car serviced fully & properly and I trust my service centre which is meticulous in making sure the servicing schedule is adhered to.
I also prefer to choose my oil when I buy my car and then use that same oil for the duration of my ownership.
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Thanks for the welcome & good wishes guys ! To clarify things I have only used hyundai filters & Shell ultra synthetic 5w40 oil. Apparently my service records aren't detailed enough & I don't have a service validation stamp ! I guess a rubber stamp on paper is a sign of a good service !
I'll let you know how it all ends, I've been told if arbitration doesn't get a result in a month, it will go before a Judge & his decision is final............... :scared:
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Thanks for the welcome & good wishes guys ! To clarify things I have only used hyundai filters & Shell ultra synthetic 5w40 oil. Apparently my service records aren't detailed enough & I don't have a service validation stamp ! I guess a rubber stamp on paper is a sign of a good service !
I'll let you know how it all ends, I've been told if arbitration doesn't get a result in a month, it will go before a Judge & his decision is final............... :scared:
I'm sure that if done by indy then Hy require an itemised bill in addition to any stamp in the book.
so have you got these?
The T&C are detailed in the handbook/service book so have you checked these?
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Hi mick 62
:wttc:
Sorry to hear about your trouble, but looking forward to hear the outcome of this.
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OK, genuine parts, well that's 1 argument sorted at least, however there are many members that do NOT use OEM parts, so be warned fellas.
Can you describe how the failure occurred and whether there were any warning signs before at all. This is a very rare fault, than goodness. I believe, a sign of failure is the commencement of a whine becoming evident, not unlike a large truck turbo engine.
What type of driving do you do, high speed driving and stopping with engine off are NOT recommended as the oil, as good as it is, can cook onto the turbo shaft, like fat on an oily frypan. It can't be removed and becomes a source of friction which can lead to failure. Could this have happened to you. It is recommended that after high speed driving that you cruise or idle the engine at least for 1 minute to allow the shaft to cool a little.
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Yesterday I got a visit from a fellow from the the department of fair trading who inspected my vehicle & paper work- all in all he was satisfied the vehicle had been serviced correctly- he did point out that there was no proof that all the written entries in my service book hadn't all been written in in one night ! I'm guessing this was one of hyundais argument's- I pointed out that all my receipts for parts matched the service dates. So this is the sort of scrutiny I am under. The ball is back Hyundai's court............ By the way the turbo shaft had sheared which I guess was the beginning of the end ! To answer your ? Phil there was no warning of the failure ,I was reving up to about 4k in 2nd gear heard a a pop/click sound & lost power -actually thought the aftercooler hose may have popped off .....had a look under the bonnet couldn't see any thing out of the ordinary, moved the car around the corner off the highway & noted lots of white smoke behind me...... So if you ever see white smoke pull over shut it down & get it towed to your dealer !
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"What type of driving do you do, high speed driving and stopping with engine off are NOT recommended as the oil, as good as it is, can cook onto the turbo shaft, like fat on an oily frypan. It can't be removed and becomes a source of friction which can lead to failure. Could this have happened to you. It is recommended that after high speed driving that you cruise or idle the engine at least for 1 minute to allow the shaft to cool a little."
Can anyone tell us the intricacies of the turbos, particularly the bearing arrangement ? Are we using ball bearing type arrangements (on the GD torbo) or ceramic plain bearings. The ball bearing arrangement is much less prone to shutdown lubrication related failure.
The owners manual warns against shutting down the engine early after prolonged high speed driving etc, stating that the engine needs to run for some time to allow the turbocharger to cool. I know our turbos aren't water cooled, but I'm interested in what the bearing arrangement is.
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O.K for the record...the car's usual workday is a 40km round trip on the highway from one country town to another. My wife is the main driver & drives it gently but knows not to labour the engine. When I drive I'll blow the cobwebs out but well below redline & always let it idle down for a minute IF it has been working hard. This engine has had a easy life - I'm going to go with the S__t Happens line of thought because as inconvenient as it is for Hyundai sometimes it just does ! :whistler:
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O.K for the record...the car's usual workday is a 40km round trip on the highway from one country town to another. My wife is the main driver & drives it gently but knows not to labour the engine. When I drive I'll blow the cobwebs out but well below redline & always let it idle down for a minute IF it has been working hard. This engine has had a easy life - I'm going to go with the S__t Happens line of thought because as inconvenient as it is for Hyundai sometimes it just does ! :whistler:
Thanks... you sound like a fair and reasonable person.. :goodjob: and good luck!
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Got a call from The Department of fair trading today...............Hyundai is not going to honour the warranty... BUT they are going to do the repair as a act of GOOD WILL ! - Call it what you like but I reckon that's a good result . :happydance: :happydance: :happydance: :happydance: :happydance: :happydance: :happydance: :happydance: :happydance: :happydance: :happydance: :happydance: :happydance: :happydance: :happydance: :happydance: :happydance: :happydance: :happydance: :happydance: :happydance: :happydance: :happydance: :happydance: :happydance: :happydance: :happydance: :happydance: :happydance: :happydance: :happydance: :happydance: :happydance: :happydance: :happydance: :happydance: :happydance: :happydance: :happydance: :happydance: :happydance: :happydance: :goodjob2:
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Good result, mick 62. So basically Hyundai aren't admitting that they should do the warranty work, but they are doing the warranty work? :head_butt:
:goodjob:
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My 'goodwill' would be long gone if they tried that stunt on me.....
Any service manager who says that using a non Hyundai part voids the warranty is actually engaging in anti competitive practice and is breaking the law. You can use any filter so long as it complies with the specs.
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Result. Yep :goodjob:
Wait until the repair is complete, and you're happy with it, then bad-mouth Hyundai all over the internet of things.
Oh, hang on...
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:victory: :happydance:
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Good to hear, Mick... :victory:
Sometimes it pays off to take the battle... :victory:
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Your not going to believe this ! the guy from hyundai who said they'd repair it rang Fair Trading & said he only thought the turbo was damaged & would only cover the cost of the turbo..........guess he didn't read all the info I sent him including the workshop report saying the engine was hydraulically locked. So after all that it is not over yet ! Stay tuned we may be going to see a judge after all. :head_butt:
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:disapp: :sweating: :fum:
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:disapp: :disapp: :disapp: :disapp: :disapp: :disapp: :disapp: :disapp:
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Your not going to believe this ! the guy from hyundai who said they'd repair it rang Fair Trading & said he only thought the turbo was damaged & would only cover the cost of the turbo..........guess he didn't read all the info I sent him including the workshop report saying the engine was hydraulically locked. So after all that it is not over yet ! Stay tuned we may be going to see a judge after all. :head_butt:
Nice try, but he won't get away with that. The design of the turbo is such that at failure, with engine running, the boost which was available will cease and be replaced by vacuum due to the action of the pistons drawing in air. This would naturally draw in any metal fragments from the turbo turbine, possibly damaging the bores, pistons, injectors & valves etc. A full pull down of the motor, would be an expected requirement IMO.
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Problem solved....or is it ?! I was prepared to take this claim as far as I could- it seems every time I stood my ground hyundai's warranty guy would give a little more ground- so in the end I was asked to return the vehicle to the dealer to see how siezed the engine was & if it wasn't siezed they would remove the head & inspect for damage ,debris etc. The Turbo & aftercooler would be also changed as a act of good will........
I get a phone call saying pick up the car it's all fixed.....Yep it's running fine ,so I ask how did the head look- they don't know as they only changed the turbo & aftercooler- thats all they were asked to do. I ask do you really believe that the engine oil that got sucked through the aftercooler would have been free of broken turbo ?! No answer just DUMB looks : :wacko: :wacko: Well if it stuffs up "I'll be back" asta la vista baby. What a pain in the backside -just the way they wanted it to be . The bottom line is if you don't service your vehicle through a Hyundai dealer they will do their best to squirm out of warranty. Interestingly I was looking at a Kia Rio only yesterday & said I have my own licensed mechanic who does not have have a licenced buisness & would that be O.K. ? The sales guy tells me if I use genuine oils & filters that would be fine......Heard that before ! If you go down this road keep detailed records & be prepared to be immune to bullshit- you'll be hearing lots of it.
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I hope this is the end of your problem.
As far as servicing outside HY, I imagine all manufacturers would adopt a similar stance. The turbo is an expensive item and it broke without any Hy technician having the opportunity to inspect or repair the device during the car's lifetime. I think you've done pretty well, actually.
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:whsaid:
Thanks for the update Mick. :goodjob:
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I hope this is the end of your problem.
As far as servicing outside HY, I imagine all manufacturers would adopt a similar stance. The turbo is an expensive item and it broke without any Hy technician having the opportunity to inspect or repair the device during the car's lifetime. I think you've done pretty well, actually.
:whsaid:
I doubt very much the turbo would be inspected at any service unless there was a costumer complaint.
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:wts:
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:Yeah: :wts: :MeToo:
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The sales guy tells me if I use genuine oils & filters that would be fine......Heard that before ! If you go down this road keep detailed records & be prepared to be immune to bullshit- you'll be hearing lots of it.
Nice to see your car fixed Mick. If I were buying a new Kia, before signing an order I would insist this "Sales Guy" put his statement in writing
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The sales guy tells me if I use genuine oils & filters that would be fine......Heard that before ! If you go down this road keep detailed records & be prepared to be immune to bullshit- you'll be hearing lots of it.
Nice to see your car fixed Mick. If I were buying a new Kia, before signing an order I would insist this "Sales Guy" put his statement in writing
I'm guessing he might not be so keen ! All in all it has been a "interesting" & educational experience - I've heard many opinions on who's "right" but simply the bottom line is if Hyundai gives a warranty they MUST adhere to Australian consumer law regardless of their fine print. To quote a ACCC news letter I found : New & used Vehicle Servicing In relation to to general servicing, motor vehicle dealers are entitled to insist that any servicing is carried out by qualified staff, according to the manufacturers specifications, & using genuine or appropriate quality parts where required. Provided these conditions are met, regardless of where you choose to get your car serviced, your warranty will remain intact . Unquote !
My main gripe with Hyundai servicing was the excessive mark up on parts ie $40 for a genuine oil filter that I could get for a 1/3 of the price on line...being charged top $ for 6 litres of oil to overfill my engine that only requires 5 etc etc......... no wonder they don't want you servicing elsewhere ! From now on I will supply ALL the fluids & filters & they can supply the labour - & they can't argue with that.
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My main gripe with Hyundai servicing was the excessive mark up on parts ie $40 for a genuine oil filter that I could get for a 1/3 of the price on line...being charged top $ for 6 litres of oil to overfill my engine that only requires 5 etc etc......... no wonder they don't want you servicing elsewhere ! From now on I will supply ALL the fluids & filters & they can supply the labour - & they can't argue with that.
Many owners here do precisely that, including me.
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Hi all, i will post here instead open a new topic , problem solved now completed . I own a 2011 I30 diesel 115 HP non DPF , 51.000 km, which in the last couple of months put on exhaust a lot of black smoke at strong acceleration . Diagnostic after Hy delaer first check : EGR must be clean . I paid 50 Eur for this , they claim this is not cover by warranty. Probleam not solved because after one week i came back with the same problem , second diagnostic : turbo fail . Fortunately for me , this will be solved under warranty . Car have been serviced by Hy delaer by the manufacturer maintenance schedule , stating whit fluids and filters changed werewolf , brake pads , etc.
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alc2 ( I would be asking for a refund of the EGR cleaning fee) :whistler:
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Nobody's ever noticed you have a werewolf at service time. :exclaim: :exclaim: :eek:
I think that may be your problem. :mrgreen:
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Turbo failure due to werewolf shedding hair, no doubt. :whistler:
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:lol:
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Did you ever notice the turbo sou ding like a police siren at low revs? I forced Hyu dai to replace the turbo in my 09 because of the noise it was making. I had to wait over 8 weeks for the turbo to come in because they said they had actually made changes to the part?! Possibly admitting that there was a design issue. I had to fight hyundai for it to be changed under warranty.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
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It's amazing how different experiences can be. My turbo got replaced without me even asking for it, as far as I was concerned the problem was in the glow plugs but they said turbo and replaced it. A week later they replaced the glow plugs which fixed the problem :razz: :lol:
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It's amazing how different experiences can be. My turbo got replaced without me even asking for it, as far as I was concerned the problem was in the glow plugs but they said turbo and replaced it. A week later they replaced the glow plugs which fixed the problem :razz: :lol:
Definitely a win/win :goodjob:
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It's amazing how different experiences can be. My turbo got replaced without me even asking for it, as far as I was concerned the problem was in the glow plugs but they said turbo and replaced it. A week later they replaced the glow plugs which fixed the problem :razz: :lol:
Sounds like someone else may have needed a turbo - Are you sure they actually changed it - there are plenty of scammers out there.
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Does anyone know the exact model of the i30 turbo?
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Hi Elantraelite, im currently fighting with Hyundai as well. My 2009 i30 turbo diesel's turbo recently went with the sirens and is 2.5months out of warranty. They originally (last monday) was going to warrant/goodwill the part for us to only pay $800 for labour which was due to be fixed on wednesday this week. But today sent back saying now we need to pay $2800. Not happy. So i got legal advice and they told me to go to ACCC & OFT. Is that what you had done.
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Hi Elantraelite, im currently fighting with Hyundai as well. My 2009 i30 turbo diesel's turbo recently went with the sirens and is 2.5months out of warranty. They originally (last monday) was going to warrant/goodwill the part for us to only pay $800 for labour which was due to be fixed on wednesday this week. But today sent back saying now we need to pay $2800. Not happy. So i got legal advice and they told me to go to ACCC & OFT. Is that what you had done.
Sorry to hear that! Don't suppose you have anything in writing about the first offer (I'm sure that would help) :Pout:
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It seems like I'm reading about turbo failure left right and centre on this forum. I wonder are the failures completely random, or is there anything that needs to be done to prevent it. I know about cooling the turbo for a minute before turning off the engine.
Up till now I've been doing 15000km a year and servicing my i30 as per the book with yearly services. I don't feel I meet the criteria for requiring interim 7500km services but I wonder does this increase the risk of turbo failure?
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No
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I certainly believe in cooling the turbo. My partner and I always wait few seconds before turning the car off. This at least pumps some oil through the turbo to allow it to cool if has been worked hard.
Each to their own, but I believe in changing the oil every 7,500km. Changing the oil at 15,000km seems like a long time between changes when you consider how quickly the oil becomes dirty. Changing it regularly would mean cleaner oil flowing through the turbo.
Im no expert, but if it prevents damage i'll try it.
I recently sold my 2005 Hyundai Elantra, beautiful car andwas serviced without fail every 7,500km. After 130,000km you will never have seen a cleaner or more healthier engine. The oil was always transparent. Gosh I miss that car!
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It seems like I'm reading about turbo failure left right and centre on this forum. I wonder are the failures completely random, or is there anything that needs to be done to prevent it. I know about cooling the turbo for a minute before turning off the engine.
If you have a DPF, I think it's especially important to cool at idle when turning off during the DPF regeneration. I'm not sure where that additional injected fuel actually burns, but if the turbo gets as much heat as the DPF, then shutting off during regen is as bad thing as shutting off immediately after full throttle speeding at the motorway. :undecided: However the user manual says nothing about how to know when the DPF is regenerating, or what to do / not do when it occurs. The DPF also has a bad habit to start the regen at the worst possible moment, typically few kilometers before getting to the work and no time to do additional driving to finish the regen.
I have read somewhere (maybe even in this forum) that early FDs with VGT turbos have had problems with variable vanes moving beyond their limits, hitting to the turbine blades and making that loud whistling sound.
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I have read somewhere (maybe even in this forum) that early FDs with VGT turbos have had problems with variable vanes moving beyond their limits, hitting to the turbine blades and making that loud whistling sound.
I hope not... :scared: :sweating:
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In my view the Garret turbo used in the i30 CRDi has proven very reliable. I think Cruiserfied would support my claim?
Considering the number of CRDi owners who have come through this site, I can old count probably a dozen failures. The numbers will, of course, increase as the cars get older. :cool:
I agree with Phil that with normal driving 15,000 services are often enough. Modern oils are very good and are expected to last longer than 15k in Europe. The fact they go black quickly in Diesels is to do with the combustion process and does not really adversely affect the oils lubricating qualities.