i30 Owners Club
GOT PROBLEMS OR ISSUES? => PETROL => Topic started by: nangers on January 27, 2016, 21:16:22
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Hi all,
I just took delivery of a brand new 2015 petrol i30 SR premium (top of the range) 2 weeks ago. I then had front parking sensors fitted by an auto-electrician. Front sensors brand is reknowned Australian brand Parksafe (Pro version, with 5 year warranty)
http://parksafe.com.au/products/front-parking-sensors/ (ftp://parksafe.com.au/products/front-parking-sensors/)
Since day of installation, the front parking sensors have been randomly beeping and now completely just does not work. Been back to installer 4 times and sensors have been changed 2 times, sensor module has been changed once, we have tried connecting power source to different sources. Still the same problem.
Installer has been in touch with Parksafe manufacturer, and Parksafe also do not know what is the cause of the problem. They said it could be electromagnetic interference with the electronics in the i30, since it is the premium model with a lot of features.
Questions:
1) Has anyone had front sensors put on their premium i30 and experienced this problem?
2) Does any one know how to fix the problem .............. even the pros and the manufacturer in my case have no idea and say this is the first time it has happened to them. Actually they said this is the first time Parksafe has had front sensors installed on an i30.
Thanks in advance for your help!
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A British member Alan, had quite a saga with sensors but it was a different model and brand from memory...
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I had front sensors fitted to my top-of the range I30 3 years ago because the standard sensors fitted to the car were just one sensor at each front corner and no sensors in the middle.
The saga Dazz referred to was my long fight with Hyundai over them calling the 2 sensors (fitted as standard) "front parking sensors" - because they did not protect the front of the car.
I eventually purchased and had the dealer fit the standard kit that Hyundai offered as optional extras for the basic i30 that did not come as standard with front sensors. The kit is made by a company called Cobra (Now called Vodaphone Cobra) who supply all the OEM sensors to the Hyundai/KIA factories.
Hence I finished up with two separate systems on the front of the car. The original 2 sensors displayed in the instrument binnacle and the extra 4 sensors were just audio beep warning.
Despite all the electronics in my car - neither set of sensors ever gave me any problems - they worked perfectly.
I have now had 4 front sensors fitted to my New KIA Venga - again a Cobra kit - which again is performing faultlessly.
I'm sorry I can't throw any light on your problems - other than a gut feel that it is nothing to do with the car electronics and more to do with the kit or how it was fitted.
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Thanks Alan, apart from Alan I can't recall much recent feedback on aftermarket sensors. Might be worth doing some random searches of the site for parksafe and or sensors.
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The sensors use ultrasonic waves to function and as such wouldn't be subject to "interference" by other electronics in your car.
As a start, I would be testing the module with a multimeter and checking where the power is taken from to ensure the unit is actually on when required. Check for good Earth to the body of course, too. The unit should be capable of being tested by the installer and if working all should be good.
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Thanks for everyone's reply. I feel this is going to be a nightmare to sort out. Will update everyone to see how it goes. Parksafe brand is meant to be a really good brand. And I have no knowledge of car electrics so am really just at the whims of my installer and the manufacturer parksafe.
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What Phil said!
The random beeping and now just not working - could be indicative of a bad connection (wiring) and/or interference (as they have suggested), it could also indicate something shorting (wiring) when it shouldn't. The fact the sensors and the module itself has been changed would indicate potentially a wiring problem (excluding them having a bad batch of modules and/or controllers) - of course it isn't unknown for things to be damaged from wiring issues when someone has really stuffed up. Hope it is just a bad wiring connection of some sought - anyway any damage due to installation is their problem not yours.
You mention 'connecting power source to different sources' - is there a separate power supply unit? or are you just referring to the power connections on the module? If separate they should really try changing that too - weird issues have been known to happen due to faulty power supplies (e.g. supplying power but not correct levels all or some of the time).
While it could be, as the say electro-magnetic interference (EMI aka RFI - Radio Frequency Interference), it really shouldn't be - an engine can be a noisey place in such regards and their product should be designed to handle it (esp. when they are designed for a wide range of vehicles). I don't know where they locate the control module - but at the very least, if it is in the cabin, the sensor wires have to run past the engine one way or another - which should cause them to have designed for EMI/RFI.
Of course, as the problem is persisting even with sensors and module changed, the first thing they should be doing is proving both the previous module and sensors work fine out of the car - e.g. wired up together 'on the bench'. They should also do the same for the current module (ideally the sensors too - but that would require removing them from bumper, etc.). The reason being if one, or both, DON'T work (and assuming it isn't a bad batch of modules and/or sensors) then something has caused one, or more of them, damage - probably something to do with the wiring and they really shouldn't try any more swapping until they trace what has caused it. (I doubt very much, while it isn't unknown, that this would be a case of a faulty device damages another device and then damage bounce back and forth as only one faulty device is replaced at a time).
If they prove wiring is perfect (including connections to module) and/or replace the wiring and the modules/sensors checked out on the bench - then it leans towards EMI/RFI. But then the question is why the i30 and not other modern vehicles?
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Just had one silly thought - something that one or two of the others here maybe able to answer... I have heard it is done in other vehicles but that could just be people with a little knowledge getting the wrong end of the stick... however it potentially could cause devices to have issues if not designed for it and/or their power filtering wasn't too good...
The GD models aren't transmitting data over 'power' conductor/cables/signal lines such as IGN/IGN1/ON connections?
Just a stupid thought - as not enough filtering in a device could be letting such through (if it exists)... though it really should have enough filtering anyway (EFI). As I said have seen people saying it is done in their vehicles - don't know if it is true or not... usually there isn't such a concern with getting things doing double duty (power and data) in cars (at least not in this segment of the market).
However there is: DCC (model trains), Net-over-power (data over power lines around the house) and PoE (power over ethernet - power to a network device via network cable) to name a few technologies that do it in various ways... all have problems if not properly filtered.
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Wow, thanks for the thorough and thought out reply. The ONLY thing they have not changed, is the original wiring. They have changed the module, they have changed the sensors, but the original cables that connect the sensors to the module, they have not changed (probably because it involves a lot of work to pull out the cables and rewire them). I kept asking the installer could it be a bad connection or broken wire somewhere, but he said no. The way the sensors is going, as soon as I turn it on, it just beeps and stays beeping, so it almost seems like there is a short circuit somewhere. Anyway we will see how it all goes. Never thought installing a good quality brand front sensor that I paid more money for would cause all this hassle!
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Well he might be quite right when he says no - the thing is has he proven that to himself and/or others (that there is no fault there)? Or does he 'just know' it isn't the wiring - I tend to find, in electronics, when you "know" it can't be something it quite often is what will be found to be where the issue is.
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I tend to find, in electronics, when you "know" it can't be something it quite often is what will be found to be where the issue is.
:MeToo: :goodjob:
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Ok, after further investigation, I think we may have found the problem. The front 2 sensors are sitting too close to the front number plate and picking the number plate up. I need to find a away to mount the front sensors, so they sit forward and flush with the front number plate - at present the front sensors sit recessed in the front grille of the new i30 design. Does anyone know where to get a rubber/plastic pad so I can mount the front sensors forward so it will not pick up the sides of the number plate? I don't even know where (http://)to look to get something like this.
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With respect, for what you are paying that should be their worry, not yours.. :confused:
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True, I will ask the installer, however, he is on holidays for 2 months :neutral:
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Oh, that kind of explains it then.. :fum:
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IMO the installer needs to buy a new grill and install them further out if they are picking up the number plate.
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Or perhaps a set of slimline plates would give you the necessary clearance? :undecided:
:link: Slimline number plates : VicRoads (https://www.vicroads.vic.gov.au/registration/number-plates/standard-number-plates/slimline-number-plates)
Costs might be prohibitive though... :neutral:
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Or perhaps a set of slimline plates would give you the necessary clearance? :undecided:
:link: Slimline number plates : VicRoads (https://www.vicroads.vic.gov.au/registration/number-plates/standard-number-plates/slimline-number-plates)
Costs might be prohibitive though... :neutral:
I think the slimlines (at least with 6 digits) are as wide (~372mm) as std. plates - the less digits in the rego the less wide the plate.
Possibly a USA style plate would work (at least in regards to width clearance) - but again cost.
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As to your question about pads - no real idea... but I can give a couple of ideas.... You could try Super Cheap or similar - they might have something suitable that can be adapted and adhered to the bumper. Hobby shops might have something. I know jaycar sells some form a plastic pallets that you melt to make custom shapes - not sure how UV, heat resistant, brittle they are though. Maybe get something 3D printed if you know someone with one.
Though I am generally in the boat of installer and/or manufacturer (if their recommendation/instructions were not right) should rectify the problem, I understand the time delay you indicated. So I feel any such pads/blocks, etc. should not be permanently affixed - obviously you don't want them to come off unexpectedly but not permanently bonded/causes damage on removal.
Another way around it, I don't know if it actually possible but here goes, is potentially getting the sensors seeing the plate mounted further out on the bumper - which would require new holes... if you keep the piece of plastic from these holes (assuming a circular drill was used or other device leaving a circular piece of plastic) then you might be able to get a bumper dent place to use them to fill the old holes and 'repair' it so they can't be seen. If you decided to try this - I would investigate if a bumper repair place could do this first. And, of course, cost may make this a non-option.
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One other thought as a temporary fix - though not sure about how legal it would be. Either from number plate readability and/or damaging one...
If the plates extend past the number plate mounting panel (as shown in the photo) and there is enough length... you could bend (where the mounting panel ends) the ends in so they almost touch the bumper - hopefully this would mean it would be clear of the sensors angle of view.
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Thanks for the suggestions! All really good. I may go to a panel shop and ask them what is the best. Otherwise 3D printing sounds good. Tried bending the number plate already, still didn't work!
These Parksafe sensors have an extremely wide angle of activation, so hence the problem. If I went with a cheap chinese sensor with narrow sensor fields, it would not have been a problem!
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Thanks for the suggestions! All really good. I may go to a panel shop and ask them what is the best. Otherwise 3D printing sounds good. Tried bending the number plate already, still didn't work!
No Problem. Bugger on the bending not working - sought of thought that might be a tripping point (working on the basis parking sensors are probably best having a very wide angle).
These Parksafe sensors have an extremely wide angle of activation, so hence the problem. If I went with a cheap chinese sensor with narrow sensor fields, it would not have been a problem!
:lol: Sometimes cheap is good it seems. At the very least though the installer and/or manufacturers will know for next time and/or that they need to either mount them elsewhere or make a fitting kit to bring the sensors forward.
One other 'silly' idea - I don't know if it is possible on the GDs (my mother's is 3k KM away)... if the number plate is mounted on a mounting panel/block... is it possible to remove it (e.g. un-clip/un-screw-able - rather than cutting away) and mount the number plate direct to the bumper (hopefully moving if back enough to be out of range of sensors)? Or move the mount plate elsewhere?
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Yeap. I have already removed the number plate mount and mounted the number plate directly on the front grill, so it is sitting as much back as possible ............... however the sensors are still picking it up. That is how wide angle the sensors are!
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Thanks for the suggestions! All really good. I may go to a panel shop and ask them what is the best. Otherwise 3D printing sounds good. Tried bending the number plate already, still didn't work!
These Parksafe sensors have an extremely wide angle of activation, so hence the problem. If I went with a cheap chinese sensor with narrow sensor fields, it would not have been a problem!
The control box for my Cobra sensors can be connected to a laptop loaded with the Cobra software. This allows the installer to adjust the sensor spread and range for each of 4 sensors.
If your brand are as sophisticated as you indicated - your guy must be able to do the same.
Otherwise you will be plagued with false alarms when you pass parked cars or are close to adjacent vehicles in slow traffic. I would have thought that your guy could set the sensors to ignore the reg plate.
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Yeap. I have already removed the number plate mount and mounted the number plate directly on the front grill, so it is sitting as much back as possible ............... however the sensors are still picking it up. That is how wide angle the sensors are!
To use a quote from the ad of another vehicle maker (not sure if it was NZ only or NZ and AU)... bugger me - Toyota Bugger Ad (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k1fqqdXxlPk)
Had an idea you might have tried that, and also that it might not work - as it looks like the chrome pieces stand proud of the rest in photos.
Maybe you could get a mount (from a wreckers) cut it in half and use that to mount the sensors on? At least until it can be fixed in a more correct manner (installer, etc.).
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What i have done now is to pull out the sensors half way and fix it in that position with bluetack to keep it from falling out all the way. Seems to work well at the moment. But very crude way to fix it. Hoping when my installer comes back he can find a more aesthetically pleasing solution. Ill post a picture of how it looks at the moment.
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The second picture in this Hyundai UK document shows where the front sensors are located as a factory fit.
:link: 2015 Hyundai i30 facelift prices, photos and specs revealed | carwow (https://www.carwow.co.uk/news/2015-Hyundai-i30-prices-specs-revealed-1761)
This model has an extra sensor on the side of the wheel arch for auto parallel parking
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Thanks for the link to the pictures. very helpful. My sensors are installed in different locations, as we do not have an option in australia to have factory fit front sensors to the i30s.
I try to attach my pictures, but it says it is too large. when I try to downsize my pictures to 50kb, the pictures are so low quality it is unrecognisable.
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Thanks for the link to the pictures. very helpful. My sensors are installed in different locations, as we do not have an option in australia to have factory fit front sensors to the i30s.
I try to attach my pictures, but it says it is too large. when I try to downsize my pictures to 50kb, the pictures are so low quality it is unrecognisable.
We limit the size of attachments to save bandwidth on this privately funded site and the size of back ups. Plus, they are easily lost if the site crashes. Best to host them on a hosting site like Photo bucket or imgur and post an image link in your reply... tutorial in welcome section...
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Ok here is picture of how I have mounted front sensor with blue tack so far :rolleyes: So far, been 2 days of driving and no more random beeps. I will keep testing it for the next month in all weather conditions and see whether it is still stable.
If it seems stable after a month or so and also in rain, I think I may just remove the blutack and just use black silicon to fill in where the blutack is at the moment. This way, it will be water proof, still hold the sensors in a stable position and if I ever need to replace the sensors, I can just pull it out and re-silicon again. What do y'all think of this silicon idea?
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Okay - that seems to work :)
As for silicon - it is a practical solution with little expense, and you won't have to get/make something custom (from scratch or customizing another part). Don't know how it would react to body work and/or how it long it will last (UV, heat, vibration, etc.) - possibly someone will know what is suitable. As for look/styling not sure - if black silicon it probably isn't going to draw much attention... other colours might.
While still running with the silicon idea... though it would up expense slightly... maybe see if you can get some black PVC pipe that fits the hole in bumper (I would suspect if it did so reasonably tightly the sensor would sit on top of the other end. Would require less silicone and colour of it probably wouldn't be noticeable - downside is it would require someway to feed the wires thorough the short piece of pipe.
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You could try plumbers pvc pipe and have it coloured the same as your existing paintwork. It comes in various sizes.
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Or use clear silicone, but for what you have paid you really shouldn't have to do this...
What did the installer say about Alan's mention of reprogramming them? Can you ask him questions by email or something?
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... for what you have paid you really shouldn't have to do this...
Echo that.
They're either not working to spec or not fitted to spec. Either way, they're not fit for purpose...
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:wts:
You may as well have fitted them yourself at this rate.
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Thanks for all these suggestions, as there is quite a high chance that the installer would not know what to do himself ................ that's what I am preparing for anyway.
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I think a substantial rebate or discount is in order.
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I am posting an update to the resolution to my problem. I decided to not wait for my installer as he is on holidays for another month.
So I went to Supercheap Auto in the hope of finding a rubber grommet. It turned out that they had an exact grommet size that fit the sensors perfectly - 3/4 inch.
http://www.supercheapauto.com.au/online-store/products/Champion-Wiring-Grommet-3-4-Handy-Pack.aspx?pid=17410#Recommendations (ftp://www.supercheapauto.com.au/online-store/products/Champion-Wiring-Grommet-3-4-Handy-Pack.aspx?pid=17410#Recommendations)
Cost me $6 for 2 grommets.
Attached is a picture of the install.
Moral of the story - sometimes installing a better quality product will cause more problems than installing an lesser quality product. In my case, installing a better quality sensor with wider angle of detection caused all the problems, whereas installing a cheaper chinese sensor with a smaller angle of detection would not have caused this problem.
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Good cheap fix. :goodjob:
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Nice! That looks good. :goodjob:
I notice that number plate mount isn't mounted - and I suspect it will break your sensor fix if it was. Have you put anything - like foam tape - to cushion the number plate from the bumper? To reduce (potential) vibration and/or plate marking the bumper by movement (e.g. rubbing paint off or scratching).
In the long term I would be after the installer to fix it (once they return), but that is just me. Course that also depends on if you feel they are able to do such.
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I'm not worried about the number plate scratching the grill. The number plate would always cover the scratched grill anyway. To be honest, I really cant be bothered chasing up the installer anymore. I've put too much time and effort thinking about this to bother. I'm just glad that I have sensors that work and if ever needed to be replaced, it is an easy pop out and plug in new sensors.
Thank you to everyone here for all the help and suggestions.
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I think the fault lies in fixing the sensor to the recessed part of the grille (that is how it looks to me). If that is the case, it is an epic blunder by the installer & should be remedied in full by the installer.
The sensor must be fitted to the most forward face of the area to be protected.