[AlanHo]

There is an article in this week's edition of the UK Auto Express Magazine about a guy who has a 2008 Vauxhall Vectra (Opel Vectra is the Euro version) which has had 2 dual mass flywheels replaced in 3 years - under warranty - and the flywheel has now failed again - just outside warranty - for which he has to pay £1700 for the repair.

He has appealed to Vauxhall to meet the cost because of the high incidence of failures but all they agreed to do is to give him a 12 month warranty on the replacement which he is having to pay for.

After representations by the magazine, Vauxhall have softened a little and have agreed to pay for a detailed inspection to try and determine the cause of the repeated failures and to help with the cost of rectifying the problem.

Motor Codes - the automotive industry regulator - stated that they expected Vauxhall to get to the bottom of the problem and fix it - otherwise the owner should take the legal route.

If that isn't a big enough worry for us diesel owners with cars that have dual mass flywheels - which includes the i30 - is the statement from the Automobile Association which said "Dual mass flywheels are not as reliable as solid flywheels - but we would expect them to last at least FOUR TO FIVE years. .......Yeowks!!!!

Warranty Direct - the extended warranty insurer has stated that last year they paid out on 13 flywheel claims for Vectras and a similar number from other brands including Audi and VW..........Cripes!!!!

[eye30]

includes the i30 - is the statement from the Automobile Association which said "Dual mass flywheels are not as reliable as solid flywheels - but we would expect them to last at least FOUR TO FIVE years. .......Yeowks!!!!

Time to get rid now mine is coming up to its 5th birthday and warranty expires....

[Shambles]

It's all down to how you take off, imho.

Judicious use of the clutch should prevent dmf failures, unless it's a GM dmf

[Asterix]

One can only hope that it will not be an issue for the Hyundai cars.

I know there was problems with those DMF some years ago when I worked at a VW dealer. 

[Dazzler]

includes the i30 - is the statement from the Automobile Association which said "Dual mass flywheels are not as reliable as solid flywheels - but we would expect them to last at least FOUR TO FIVE years. .......Yeowks!!!!

Time to get rid now mine is coming up to its 5th birthday and warranty expires....

Does the current model Diesel have a Dual Mass Flywheel Alan? (or only the new model?)

[AlanHo]

Does the current model Diesel have a Dual Mass Flywheel Alan? (or only the new model?)

The UK Hyundai product manager could not immediately answered my question at the Silverstone meeting but eMailed me with an answer a couple of days later. She said that the new i30 would also have a DMF - which I took to mean the existing model has one.

My dealership told me that they have had no problems with the i30 DMF's so far - and some company cars have done very high mileages.

One of our members has access to the Hyundai service website - not sure who - perhaps they can look it up

[beerman]

Would be an easy win in small claims court one would think.

Did a google search, not one i30 failure recorded online, so fingers crossed.

[Phil №❶]

It's all down to how you take off, imho.

Judicious use of the clutch should prevent dmf failures, unless it's a GM dmf

My understanding of the DMF function is to absorb excess energy produced by the power stroke of each cylinder. This is a attempt to smooth out the roughness of small diesel engines. If this is true, you could have a flywheel failure just idling the car without driving, in theory. Being kind to the clutch won't save you, IMO.

Anyone suggesting that 5 years is an acceptable lifetime for a component of that nature must be crazy.

Good to hear that Hy cars have great reliability, but after the 5 year warranty, it would be like driving around with an Aortic aneurism. When will it blow,,,,,, when will it blow,,,,,, 

PS It's also why I thought Alan might go Auto this time, but no he didn't. 

[beerman]

When I googled Dual Mass Flywheel, it seemed to be VW and Vectras that came up.

Not a mention of Hyundai. So I tried it directly, and couldn't find one.

If it is a problem, normally a google search will find it.

[Doggie 1]

 
Food for thought though regarding keeping after the 5 year warranty expires.

[Funky]

Only the 2.0litre Diesel in the MK1 i30 has a DMF fitted (as it is the same engine as fitted to SM Santa Fe, JM Tucson & NF Sonata). ALL other i30 models have solid flywheels fitted. 

I have also checked the parts listing for the new generation i30 and NONE of them show as having a DMF fitted. 

[Asterix]

Only the 2.0litre Diesel in the MK1 i30 has a DMF fitted. ALL other models have solid items fitted. 

I have also checked the parts listing for the new generation i30 and none of them show as having a DMF fitted.

That's great news. 

Thanks Funky   

[d3matt]

As Kia are offering a 7 year warranty on their cars (and of course sharing the same engine & drive train components)  then they are confident of the reliability over that sort of timescale.  Therefore this would give me some confidence of running a Hyundai past it's 5 year warranty.

But good news that they don't have DMF fitted.

[Doggie 1]

Good point. Kia here "only" give 5 years warranty as per Hyundai.

[neoto]

Here, Kia gives 7 years, but limited to 150.000 km.
I was choosing between Kia Cee'd sw and i30cw, but due to planned about 45.000 km/year, I went for Hyundai

[Doggie 1]

Sounds like a good move to me 

[komaterpillar]

New 3.0litre d4d diesel hiluxs have dmf dramas, the after market fix for it is to go back to a solid flywheel and a sprung clutch plate, the only side effect is when left in neutral at idle with the clutch out the input shaft teeth and cluster shaft teeth in the g.box rattle , wich isn't a problem just a little noisier than normal. The symptoms for a dmf/clutch failure in them is clutch shudder when taking off wich quickly gets worse over time,

[komaterpillar]

righteo ive done some research and this is what i've come up with, bare in mind all these prices are for a 2011 3.0litre turbo diesel D4D hilux. (because i have access to the toyota dealer parts database) but will suffice for comparrison purposes.
 
if your dual mass flywheel was to crap itself this is what you'd be up for:

All prices in aussie dollars

flywheel (dual mass): $1036
clutch plate: $519
pressure plate: $619
spigot bearing: $10
Throw-out bearing: $247

total: $2431

or you could go back to the old tried and proven single-mass flywheel and keep it simple and trouble free

aftermarket single-mass clutch kit including new flywheel: $1130

if it was out of warranty i know wich way i'd be going!!!

[Dazzler]

Not aware of Dual Mass Flywheel problems with the i30 so far...

[AlanHo]

I find the subject of the i30 and DMF somewhat confusing.

In my Silverstone thread I reported that I asked some questions of the Hyundai Head Office Managers present - which they were not able to answer on the spot. They answered them via Email. here is a copy and paste of the DMF topic :-

Question: Does the New Generation i30 have a dual mass flywheel?

Answer : We expect this to be the same as the current model. The petrol version will not be fitted with a dual mass flywheel but the Diesel model will be.


Yet there are posts on the forum by various members stating that the i30 does not have a DMF. It would be nice to know the sources of that information so I can take it up with the UK Head Office to clarify the matter once and for all.

[komaterpillar]

Not aware of Dual Mass Flywheel problems with the i30 so far...

i would suggest that maybe its not a well known problem YET, due to only a small percentage of the diesel model i30's having a dmf, also being in such a light car and never really being put under any harsh/real load,  may mask a potential fault for an extended period.

Only the 2.0litre Diesel in the MK1 i30 has a DMF fitted (as it is the same engine as fitted to SM Santa Fe, JM Tucson & NF Sonata). ALL other i30 models have solid flywheels fitted. 

I have also checked the parts listing for the new generation i30 and NONE of them show as having a DMF fitted. 

if the above quote is correct than wouldn't you agree that there must be a reason why hyundai/kia have gone back to solid flywheels?

[Dazzler]

I missed Funky's post... Not really a problem if that is the case 

[komaterpillar]

AlanHo you may have a biased opinion but in your new car, if you start it up, put it in neutral, let the clutch out and then go round the front of the car and listen on the g.box side of the car, can you hear a distinct chatter, almost like a rattle coming from the g.box? it should only be at idle and when you put your foot back on the clutch it should go away. if this is the case all fingers point to the clutch/flywheel setup being single mass.

[AlanHo]

AlanHo you may have a biased opinion but in your new car, if you start it up, put it in neutral, let the clutch out and then go round the front of the car and listen on the g.box side of the car, can you hear a distinct chatter, almost like a rattle coming from the g.box? it should only be at idle and when you put your foot back on the clutch it should go away. if this is the case all fingers point to the clutch/flywheel setup being single mass.

I have done as you suggested - the only noise I can hear is the soft rumble of the engine - no chatter or rattle is discernable either with the clutch in or out from the gearbox area. The engine bay on the new car is much better insulated than the previous model so I opened the bonnet for a second check.

Before others comment - yes - I did have my hearing aids in place......

[Doggie 1]

Before others comment - yes - I did have my hearing aids in place......

In your ears? 

[komaterpillar]

AlanHo you may have a biased opinion but in your new car, if you start it up, put it in neutral, let the clutch out and then go round the front of the car and listen on the g.box side of the car, can you hear a distinct chatter, almost like a rattle coming from the g.box? it should only be at idle and when you put your foot back on the clutch it should go away. if this is the case all fingers point to the clutch/flywheel setup being single mass.

I have done as you suggested - the only noise I can hear is the soft rumble of the engine - no chatter or rattle is discernable either with the clutch in or out from the gearbox area. The engine bay on the new car is much better insulated than the previous model so I opened the bonnet for a second check.

Before others comment - yes - I did have my hearing aids in place......

who knows, there are a number of contributing factors ie. transaxle g.boxes have a relatively low gear mass when compared to a standard rail box wich would reduce the volume of chatter, type of oil used / viscosity / temerature would also have an affect on wether or not the chatter is audible. or maybe the new cars do have a DMF? 

When this topic came up I hadn't heard of a DMF. After a little education I began to wonder whether this DMF could be the cause of the shaking @ 1500 in 5th gear on light throttle, even though it is designed to absorb resonances not create one. 

I had previously assumed it was simply the engine rocking on its mounts. Whatever it is, it's something with some reasonable mass and by definition it has mass. 

I'm interested to know whether/when they were fitted.

[AlanHo]

I asked my dealership to clarify which cars have the DMF. They have never had to change one since 2007 when the i30 was introduced but are fairly sure the previous model has a solid flywheel.

The UK Mobis spares data base for the new model lists the flywheel but does not state whether it is a DMF or not - however - the price for it is so much hgher than the previous one all the signs are that it does indeed have a DMF.  Ths may account for how quiet and smooth the engine in the new car is - compared to the previous model.

[baroudeur]

The UK Mobis spares data base for the new model lists the flywheel but does not state whether it is a DMF or not - however - the price for it is so much hgher than the previous one all the signs are that it does indeed have a DMF. 

Then that is at variance with your earlier post about Hyundai's answer to your enquiry

Question: Does the New Generation i30 have a dual mass flywheel?

Answer : We expect this to be the same as the current model. The petrol version will not be fitted with a dual mass flywheel but the Diesel model will be.

from which you concluded that  both previous and current models have DMF.  However,  I agree that if the later model clutch is so much more expensive  it does suggest that one has DMF and the other  does not.

I think the Hyundai reply is ambiguous and "expecting this to be the same" suggests that the question was not researched thoroughly. I still get the impression that Hyundai U.K. are merely importers with little technical knowledge of the product and that's after owning four of them over eight years.  My main dealer has more product knowledge than H.U.K. has.

[AlanHo]

The UK Mobis spares data base for the new model lists the flywheel but does not state whether it is a DMF or not - however - the price for it is so much hgher than the previous one all the signs are that it does indeed have a DMF. 

Then that is at variance with your earlier post about Hyundai's answer to your enquiry

Question: Does the New Generation i30 have a dual mass flywheel?

Answer : We expect this to be the same as the current model. The petrol version will not be fitted with a dual mass flywheel but the Diesel model will be.

from which you concluded that  both previous and current models have DMF.  However,  I agree that if the later model clutch is so much more expensive  it does suggest that one has DMF and the other  does not.

I think the Hyundai reply is ambiguous and "expecting this to be the same" suggests that the question was not researched thoroughly. I still get the impression that Hyundai U.K. are merely importers with little technical knowledge of the product and that's after owning four of them over eight years.  My main dealer has more product knowledge than H.U.K. has.

I absolutely agree with you - I have already said in another post that Hyundai UK are a commercial organisation concerned mainly with sales and marketing. I am disappointed with their response to technical questions as you will see when my current very active saga with them about Front Parking Sensors is concluded - one way or the other.

My dealer has tried hard to answer the question about DMF today - but they have not yet been required to dig into the guts of the previous model's engine. I am told that the Mobis Service data base shows a picture of the flywheel as an anonymous disc without any detail, a part number and a price.  You cannot see the construction of the flywheel for either model.

Do you have a close enough relationship with your dealer to do a double check?

I know for sure that my new car's engine is much quieter than the previous one and there is no sign of a chatter or rattle - but I was never conscious of a chatter with my previous car which leaves me unsure of where to place my bets.