i30 Owners Club
GENERAL STUFF => GENERAL DISCUSSIONS => Random Chit Chat => Topic started by: Paolo5 on December 30, 2014, 22:36:10
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I was pulled over by a policeman yesterday and booked for "Use Class A vehicle with number plate obscured".
The gentleman who pulled me over said that he couldn't read my car's numberplate as the towball was in the way.
The whole towbar is a genuine Hyundai part.
I normally only have the tongue and towball installed when I am actually towing...but on this occasion there was no trailer involved! I had a towball cover installed....one of those dedicated black plastic Supercheap gizmos that prevents grease getting on your trouser leg when you brush against it.
I would have appreciated a warning from the said gentleman but was issued with a stiff fine instead. My crime was obviously of a more serious nature than speeding by 10-20km over the limit, as determined by the magnitude of the fine.
Ironically, he didn't instruct me to remove the tongue and ball then and there....so it couldn't have posed an enormous threat after all.
Has anyone else ever received such a fine?
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Wow!! That is steep. I really think that the officer should have issued a warning, and instructed you to remove it there and then if it was such a problem. However, rules are rules. I always thought that the number plate was in an interesting position when the towbar was fitted.
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If not directed to be removed then you could be stopped again just down the road!
If number plate in correct position and genuine hy tow bar and correctly fitted then surely hy need to be contacted to obtain their observations as to why plate obscured
I would be requesting hy to explain in writing fitted as per hy's specification and lodge appeal
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I suspect the reason that the fine is so high is to discourage the use of the tow bar to avoid camera detection.
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I take that it is one of them removable one's that you can store way.
You know what hy are going to say, 'it should be removed when not in use' that will be their get out clause so to speak
you could say that you was never informed about removing it and ask them as a good will gesture to pay towards the fine
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The fine is heavy and I agree a caution would be nice.
But this has been an offence for as long as I can remember (where I am) and was enforced long before speed cameras were even invented.
Anything that obscures a number plate is not allowed so yes, the actual tow ball needs to be removed when not in use if it blocks the view of the plate.
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I agree with Doggie. It's always been a regulation and understandable given that the number plate is the only way people have of identifying the vehicle if it is involved in any kind of incident and decides to do a runner.
I'd be surprised if there wasn't some instruction somewhere in relation to removal of the tongue and ball in Hyundai's stuff.
But in any case, ignorance of the law is no excuse.
A warning should have been sufficient but I have a friend up here who was driving home from his stint at the local community radio station a couple of months ago doing everything legally because he saw the police car behind him.
But they pulled him up and booked him for the same offence.
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End of month / year, got to keep the revenue rolling in. :disapp: :fum:
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Ridiculous amount for such an "offence" I feel for you Paolo... I think it is bullshit when you see what others get away with! :disapp:
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:whsaid:
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End of month / year, got to keep the revenue rolling in. :disapp: :fum:
Ah, B.S. :lol:
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Sorry about the bad news.
I agree that the fine is very steep. But also agree rules are rules.
Might be something you can fight in court with cops.
As Johnno said. It's only meant to be fitted when in use.
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Ridiculous amount for such an "offence" I feel for you Paolo... I think it is bullshit when you see what others get away with! :disapp:
I'm sure we have all gotten aware with our fair share......Every now and again, even the most careful misses something and becomes 'that driver'.
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True Beerman, true...
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Sorry but I would have asked the Mother if he wanted to borrow my Reading glasses,yes as has been said it is an offence to obstruct the Plate view,but it is something that you don't often see it policed,this time of the year they should have streets of people pulled over for plate view obstruction,the amount of people I see with these fricking Bike rakes and three or sometimes more bikes on them,your lucky if you can make out their lights let alone their number plates.
I reckon the bloke must have missed out on a root the night before,I literally see hundreds if not thousands of cars a week,with towbars obstructing or partially obscuring their plates,I'm with Phil(revenue raising) sounds like the gentleman in question was simply a Prick
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A heavy fine, I must admit, but not able to read the number plate when the tongue is fitted is the reason you can only get a detachable towbar for the hatch. For the CW the number plate is mounted higher so no problem..
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Late but, sorry to read this.
Paolo5 if you have a clean record Driving, you could write a letter explaining your case. post with infringement notice.
they will get back to you.
on another note but a similar subject in the same state.
we have personalised number plates any colour combination you choose, sky is the limit just everything has a price tag.
well i've just about seen them all but i think the Black plate with metal flake dark gold is about hardest to read. not sure if it illuminates at night but i would expect so . well i saw a new BMW with that plate combination & a dark very dark tinted number plate cover it was near impossible to read.
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They're a bit stricter over here with No.plates. Lettering as to be to a certain height and spacing between them. front plates have to have black lettering on white reflective background, rears black on yellow and all have to have a kite mark and the plate itself as to be the right dimension but you have a option if you want a uk or eu symbol
The ones on my beemer where illegal because the lettering was in italic
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Johnno , you have a lot of country's close to UK so you probably need positive ID.
here it's all one country with a lot of water around it.
you could possibly do a search & find NSW my Plates page & see for yourself black background dark gold lettering, harder to read.
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I saw one recently, silver with light blue letters quite difficult to read.
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There is a downside to personalised plates.. With a number plate like DAZ001 I've had to stop chucking stuff out the windows and cutting people off at roundabouts.. Too easy to remember! :fum: :rofl: :rofl:
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Paolo, I agree the penalty seems high however, you, like every motorist should be aware that penalties will follow any detected breach of the law.
The Officer was only doing his job, following orders to stamp out this, and no doubt other offences.
Such orders normally follow detailed research by police intelligence that would justify targeting obstructed number plates.
Unless we are aware of this research any comment about the penalty, the offence or criticism of the officer, is uninformed whinging. Paolo, just cop it sweet, remove the tow-ball, do not do it again and move on.
Before I was critical I would at least need to know,
1. How many major crime investigations are hindered by hidden number plates on vehicles used committing crimes. (murder. armed robbery, assault, drug related and so on)
2. How many minor and major traffic offences go unpunished because of this offence (hit and run accidents, speeding, reckless and dangerous driving an so on)
3. How many lives could be saved if offenders were bought to justice and/or stopped offending
There are reasons why our Police officers target specific offences and every reason is based on the protection of the public generally.
There are reasons why detected offenders and others direct criticism towards Police and this is mostly based on ignorance of facts or pure hate for our Police.
This year Queensland has the lowest number of fatal road accidents since 1952 and that has been the result of good policing :goodjob2: I hope our Queensland Police keep up this good work and continue to detect and penalise offenders.
If anyone does not like it in Queensland, they are free to move to another State.
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Number plate colour, size, structure and plate dimensions all have to be listed in the Government Gazette before they are legal in the respective States of Australia. I used to have SWSWSW1 & SWSWSW2 in SA, had to wait two weeks for the Govt to allow smaller character heights on the plates.
The Govt Gazette, must be a real interesting read :eek:
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What was the significance of those plates Phil?
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Personal motivation.
Cost a lot of money in SA, so I ditched 'em.
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Paolo, I agree the penalty seems high however, you, like every motorist should be aware that penalties will follow any detected breach of the law.
The Officer was only doing his job, following orders to stamp out this, and no doubt other offences.
Such orders normally follow detailed research by police intelligence that would justify targeting obstructed number plates.
Unless we are aware of this research any comment about the penalty, the offence or criticism of the officer, is uninformed whinging. Paolo, just cop it sweet, remove the tow-ball, do not do it again and move on.
Before I was critical I would at least need to know,
1. How many major crime investigations are hindered by hidden number plates on vehicles used committing crimes. (murder. armed robbery, assault, drug related and so on)
2. How many minor and major traffic offences go unpunished because of this offence (hit and run accidents, speeding, reckless and dangerous driving an so on)
3. How many lives could be saved if offenders were bought to justice and/or stopped offending
There are reasons why our Police officers target specific offences and every reason is based on the protection of the public generally.
There are reasons why detected offenders and others direct criticism towards Police and this is mostly based on ignorance of facts or pure hate for our Police.
This year Queensland has the lowest number of fatal road accidents since 1952 and that has been the result of good policing :goodjob2: I hope our Queensland Police keep up this good work and continue to detect and penalise offenders.
If anyone does not like it in Queensland, they are free to move to another State.
Hornet that might all be true to, i thought all police cars could pick up rego with scanners as you drive past.
only thing i could think of is tolling on motorways & speed cameras.
or the Cop needed to reach his quota $
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John, I'm not sure all police cars are fitted with these NRCs yet.
But in any case, if the towbar is used to avoid tolls on road which I help pay for by paying tolls, or speeding fines, then I'm all for fining people who don't remove them.
Yeah, I know. I'm a grumpy old man. :p But we see all sorts of laws broken on our roads every day. There are never going to be enough police to catch them all so they can only police what they see.
Whilst I agree a bit of leeway could have been allowed here, I'm prepared to leave that choice up to the police on the spot.
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Whilst I agree a bit of leeway could have been allowed here, I'm prepared to leave that choice up to the police on the spot.
:whsaid:
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I still feel for that offence over $400 is too much. Maybe $150 - $200 would be more realistic IMO
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Hornet that might all be true to, i thought all police cars could pick up rego with scanners as you drive past.
only thing i could think of is tolling on motorways & speed cameras.
or the Cop needed to reach his quota $
In Queensland not all vehicles have yet been fitted with number plate recognition and reading devices but it will not be long before they are . By issuing fines, at this time, for this offence it should reduce the number of people driving cars with the number plate obscured or partly obscured and that will make it easier for Police to receive all information about any vehicle their onboard scanner views
This modern technology allows police to know in quick time, the form of the owner of the vehicle and if the owner is a repeat offender, be it for speeding, UIL or any other matter like outstanding warrants or parole conditions. It makes the job easier and I see that as good.
And in answer to your thoughts, No police cars cannot recognise and read number plates with scanners as they drive past IF THE NUMBER PLATE IS OBSTRUCTED. This is no doubt the reason for increased concern and high penalty for the offence
Perhaps some may say "Big Brother Tactics" but if it means our naughty citizens are disciplined well so be it
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Hornet, I like your thinking. :goodjob:
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............I literally see hundreds if not thousands of cars a week,with towbars obstructing or partially obscuring their plates,I'm with Phil(revenue raising) ....................
You seem to be countering your own argument.
If it WAS just a revenue raising exercise all the thousands of cars with obscured plates should be manna from heaven.
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They're a bit stricter over here with No.plates. Lettering as to be to a certain height and spacing between them. front plates have to have black lettering on white reflective background, rears black on yellow and all have to have a kite mark and the plate itself as to be the right dimension but you have a option if you want a uk or eu symbol
The ones on my beemer where illegal because the lettering was in italic
http://tinyurl.com/qhfknan (http://tinyurl.com/qhfknan) UK plate specification
There is no specific dimension for the plate size other than the dimensions and spacing of the characters and the margins will give a minimum size. If you could afford A1 the plate could be just 97mm long x 72mm high
My plate includes 11 so is 122mm shorter than one with a GB and numbers other than 1. :cool:
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baradeur said "There is no specific dimension for the plate size"
Baraduer, that may well be the case in the UK and Eu but not in Oz.
For your information, here in Oz the purpose of penalties is to deter potential lawbreakers and slap the knuckles of those few who break the law, it is not, and never has been, to provide revenue for the Government. The real fact is that in Queensland most who complain about fines, excessive or otherwise, represent a very small percentage of licensed drivers. The last time I saw the stats near 96% of Queensland drivers had no record of any traffic offence. Our Policing efforts therefore target just 4% of drivers who are the ones who bitch about their penalties. The other 96% are happy that Police are trying to make our roads safer for them and others who use our roads.
Take a look at this newspaper report of an accident on New Years Day
:link: Bundaberg's horror fatal the state's first for 2015 | Bundaberg NewsMail (http://www.news-mail.com.au/news/one-dead-new-years-day-crash/2499923/)
then you may appreciate why our Police try so hard to stop lawbreakers. When all the facts of this tragic accident are made known to all, then perhaps the 4% lawbreakers will stop breaking the law, but I doubt it.
When innocent decent law abiding people (husband, parent, grandparent and respected members of our community) loose their life because of irresponsible lawbreakers then I say "throw the book at the lawbreakers"
I give no time to those who may say "the police should not impose heavy fines on those who want to remain unknown and hide their number plates" or "they only do it for revenue" Thats all BS. The poor chap that died would no doubt agree with me but he cannot do that now
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baradeur said "There is no specific dimension for the plate size"
Baraduer, that may well be the case in the UK and Eu but not in Oz.
For your information, here in Oz the purpose of penalties is to deter potential lawbreakers and slap the knuckles of those few who break the law, it is not, and never has been, to provide revenue for the Government. The real fact is that in Queensland most who complain about fines, excessive or otherwise, represent a very small percentage of licensed drivers. The last time I saw the stats near 96% of Queensland drivers had no record of any traffic offence. Our Policing efforts therefore target just 4% of drivers who are the ones who bitch about their penalties. The other 96% are happy that Police are trying to make our roads safer for them and others who use our roads.
Take a look at this newspaper report of an accident on New Years Day
:link: Bundaberg's horror fatal the state's first for 2015 | Bundaberg NewsMail (http://www.news-mail.com.au/news/one-dead-new-years-day-crash/2499923/)
then you may appreciate why our Police try so hard to stop lawbreakers. When all the facts of this tragic accident are made known to all, then perhaps the 4% lawbreakers will stop breaking the law, but I doubt it.
When innocent decent law abiding people (husband, parent, grandparent and respected members of our community) loose their life because of irresponsible lawbreakers then I say "throw the book at the lawbreakers"
I give no time to those who may say "the police should not impose heavy fines on those who want to remain unknown and hide their number plates" or "they only do it for revenue" Thats all BS. The poor chap that died would no doubt agree with me but he cannot do that now
Wow steady! What warranted that as we are on the same hymn sheet.
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@baradeur giving details on license plate specs in the UK doesn't have much to do with the topic at hand here which is an Australian based issue and our regulations/laws and sizing are different to the UK.
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@baradeur giving details on license plate specs in the UK doesn't have much to do with the topic at hand here which is an Australian based issue and our regulations/laws and sizing are different to the UK.
:-[ :-[ sorry
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This just shows why there should be a world wide "rule book" for plate size, format etc as the space allocated on a car/vehicle model is the same wherever that car/vehicle is sold.
They don't alter the place if the car is sold in oz, uk, usa, russia etc as the body shape and accessory shapes is the same world wide, isn't it.....
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This just shows why there should be a world wide "rule book" for plate size, format etc as the space allocated on a car/vehicle model is the same wherever that car/vehicle is sold.
We can't get agreement between our states and territories, so no chance of a world wide agreement, especially with the EU in existence. If they tried to tell us what to do, we'd tell them where to go.
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I reckon the bloke must have missed out on a root the night before ...
:rofl:
Don't ever leave us, Rick. :goodjob:
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Here in Queensland its pretty clear whats required:
Items blocking your number plate
If you have a tow bar on your vehicle that blocks the view of your rear number plate, remove it when you’re not using it. If your vehicle’s tray is in the way, move your number plate to where it can be seen easily.
A registered trailer is allowed to block the view of your vehicle’s number plates if the trailer’s plates are visible.
Accessory plates
If a bicycle rack or other accessory blocks the view of your number plate, you will need to order an accessory plate.
An accessory plate is attached to a bike rack for example, to make your registration number visible from the required distance.
The bike rack accessory plate is a gotcha though.
:link: Replacing or changing a number plate | Transport and motoring | Queensland Government (http://www.qld.gov.au/transport/registration/numberplate/index.html)
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An update....
In NSW it is a $415 fine PLUS 3 demerit points.
Whenever I see an offending car with driver parked I let him/her know what they are risking. Each one of them has been genuinely surprised and extremely thankful for the information.
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Nice work Paolo! Your $415 fine might bring you a knighthood in the long run! :lol:
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Nice work Paolo! Your $415 fine might bring you a knighthood in the long run! :lol:
:rofl:
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Sir Paolo5 has a nice ring to it. :)
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Whenever I see an offending car with driver parked I let him/her know what they are risking. Each one of them has been genuinely surprised and extremely thankful for the information.
Likely to get a minimum of a very rude comment and a one finger salute here in the UK.
I gave up telling people that they had a rear light/indicator not working years ago.
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Whenever I see an offending car with driver parked I let him/her know what they are risking. Each one of them has been genuinely surprised and extremely thankful for the information.
Likely to get a minimum of a very rude comment and a one finger salute here in the UK.
I gave up telling people that they had a rear light/indicator not working years ago.
It shouldn't be a problem unless you're notifying them with a smartarse attitude :undecided:
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^
Just like trying to tell people they shouldn't have their fog lights on if it's not foggy.
Most of 'em don't even know they've got fog lights, let alone how to turn them on or off. :disapp:
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Most of 'em don't even know they've got fog lights, let alone how to turn them on or off. :disapp:
Funny you should say that, I was only thinking the other day I must work out whether my other lights on the calais are driving or fog lights (and how to turn them on)! :-[
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Most of 'em don't even know they've got fog lights, let alone how to turn them on or off. :disapp:
Funny you should say that, I was only thinking the other day I must work out whether my other lights on the calais are driving or fog lights (and how to turn them on)! :-[
If they're down low, they're fog lights.
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Most of 'em don't even know they've got fog lights, let alone how to turn them on or off. :disapp:
Funny you should say that, I was only thinking the other day I must work out whether my other lights on the calais are driving or fog lights (and how to turn them on)! :-[
If they're down low, they're fog lights.
I kind of suspected they were.. :goodjob: I was just hopeful they might have been driving lights... :happydance:
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From the Holden page, Dazz, the Calais V has both Fog Lamps and DRLs. The DRLs should switch off when you turn any light on.
:link: Holden Commodore Calais-V - Specs, Accessories & Features - 2015 (http://www.holden.com.au/cars/commodore/sedan-range/calais-v#features)
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From the Holden page, Dazz, the Calais V has both Fog Lamps and DRLs. The DRLs should switch off when you turn any light on.
:link: Holden Commodore Calais-V - Specs, Accessories & Features - 2015 (http://www.holden.com.au/cars/commodore/sedan-range/calais-v#features)
Thanks, I've got the DRL's sorted.. I think I know which switch turns on the fogs (but I have a lot of switches and headlights are set to auto) :goodjob:
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From the Holden page, Dazz, the Calais V has both Fog Lamps and DRLs. The DRLs should switch off when you turn any light on.
:link: Holden Commodore Calais-V - Specs, Accessories & Features - 2015 (http://www.holden.com.au/cars/commodore/sedan-range/calais-v#features)
Thanks, I've got the DRL's sorted.. I think I know which switch turns on the fogs (but I have a lot of switches and headlights are set to auto) :goodjob:
From the photos on the web, I think that you press the centre of the light switch/knob/thingy, the button with the Fog Light on it. :whistler:
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From the Holden page, Dazz, the Calais V has both Fog Lamps and DRLs. The DRLs should switch off when you turn any light on.
:link: Holden Commodore Calais-V - Specs, Accessories & Features - 2015 (http://www.holden.com.au/cars/commodore/sedan-range/calais-v#features)
Thanks, I've got the DRL's sorted.. I think I know which switch turns on the fogs (but I have a lot of switches and headlights are set to auto) :goodjob:
From the photos on the web, I think that you press the centre of the light switch/knob/thingy, the button with the Fog Light on it. :whistler:
But I think there is a fog light type picture on one of the stalks as well (I'll go and have a play shortly) or if all else fails I'll RTFM...
Are you on your way back to Broome?
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But I think there is a fog light type picture on one of the stalks as well (I'll go and have a play shortly) or if all else fails I'll RTFM...
Are you on your way back to Broome?
Don't do it, Dazz. If you do then you have to hand in your man badge!! Don't RTFM (unless you really need to). With mine, you pull the light knob out (in any mode, mine has auto as well) and it "arms" the fog lights.
I'm back in Broome at the moment. Arrived yesterday after a night in Perth (due to weather in Melbourne, missed my connection), with a night at "The Vines" courtesy of Qantas. Gotta love full service carriers, they paid for accommodation, taxi and a $30 voucher for dinner.
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But I think there is a fog light type picture on one of the stalks as well (I'll go and have a play shortly) or if all else fails I'll RTFM...
Are you on your way back to Broome?
Don't do it, Dazz. If you do then you have to hand in your man badge!! Don't RTFM (unless you really need to). With mine, you pull the light knob out (in any mode, mine has auto as well) and it "arms" the fog lights.
I'm back in Broome at the moment. Arrived yesterday after a night in Perth (due to weather in Melbourne, missed my connection), with a night at "The Vines" courtesy of Qantas. Gotta love full service carriers, they paid for accommodation, taxi and a $30 voucher for dinner.
Thanks .. I didn't go there!
I think you have been kissed on the d**k by a fairy! :Shocked: :mrgreen:
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But I think there is a fog light type picture on one of the stalks as well (I'll go and have a play shortly) or if all else fails I'll RTFM...
Are you on your way back to Broome?
Don't do it, Dazz. If you do then you have to hand in your man badge!! Don't RTFM (unless you really need to). With mine, you pull the light knob out (in any mode, mine has auto as well) and it "arms" the fog lights.
I'm back in Broome at the moment. Arrived yesterday after a night in Perth (due to weather in Melbourne, missed my connection), with a night at "The Vines" courtesy of Qantas. Gotta love full service carriers, they paid for accommodation, taxi and a $30 voucher for dinner.
Thanks .. I didn't go there!
I think you have been kissed on the d**k by a fairy! :Shocked: :mrgreen:
Is this an admission of some sort, Dazz? :undecided:
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But I think there is a fog light type picture on one of the stalks as well (I'll go and have a play shortly) or if all else fails I'll RTFM...
Are you on your way back to Broome?
Don't do it, Dazz. If you do then you have to hand in your man badge!! Don't RTFM (unless you really need to). With mine, you pull the light knob out (in any mode, mine has auto as well) and it "arms" the fog lights.
I'm back in Broome at the moment. Arrived yesterday after a night in Perth (due to weather in Melbourne, missed my connection), with a night at "The Vines" courtesy of Qantas. Gotta love full service carriers, they paid for accommodation, taxi and a $30 voucher for dinner.
Thanks .. I didn't go there!
I think you have been kissed on the d**k by a fairy! :Shocked: :mrgreen:
Is this an admission of some sort, Dazz? :undecided:
He is not gay, but $20 is $20!!
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But I think there is a fog light type picture on one of the stalks as well (I'll go and have a play shortly) or if all else fails I'll RTFM...
Are you on your way back to Broome?
Don't do it, Dazz. If you do then you have to hand in your man badge!! Don't RTFM (unless you really need to). With mine, you pull the light knob out (in any mode, mine has auto as well) and it "arms" the fog lights.
I'm back in Broome at the moment. Arrived yesterday after a night in Perth (due to weather in Melbourne, missed my connection), with a night at "The Vines" courtesy of Qantas. Gotta love full service carriers, they paid for accommodation, taxi and a $30 voucher for dinner.
Thanks .. I didn't go there!
I think you have been kissed on the d**k by a fairy! :Shocked: :mrgreen:
Is this an admission of some sort, Dazz? :undecided:
He is not gay, but $20 is $20!!
as if you didn't know , Dave..... :winker: