The Original i30 Owners Club
GENERAL STUFF => GENERAL DISCUSSIONS => Random Chit Chat => Topic started by: Lakes on July 15, 2010, 21:11:38
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Well i was thinking my car is 28 months old and has 66,000k, wondering how long the battery is expected to last? also what type of battery is it? looks like an AGM type to me but just guessing. hope someone can answer.
cheers
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I hope to get at least 5 years life from mine :D
Done 48,000 miles (same 28 months old) and still powers my USB stick just great ;)
Hey John, have you got a battery problem?
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Mine is now 2 years old and doing fine also, like Steve I would expect at least 5 years. :cool:
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My last Hy car when I sold it the battery was the original - 7 years old and still going strong.
Expecting the same again!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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I think our Diesels have a higher rated battery don't they..?. Reckon mine should last until time to upgrade :wink: (28 months and 67,000kms at the mo)
I reckon she'll be swapped before she is 3 Y/O :mrgreen:
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I've never had a car battery last less than 5 years. Usually fail on 5th or 6th winter. And none of the previous cars had lagging on the battery like the i30 does.
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i wonder if the lagging helps the battery... i know they dont like the cold, and thats what usually kills them!
i get free batteries, so i dont care how long it lasts LOL
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the wife's old car,a 99 Au falcon had the original battery in it still in 09.it died about a month before she got her cw. :razz:
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A battery generally lasts between 4-7 years depending on climate and use.
Here in the UK with the temp going up and down so much 4-6 years would be about average.
There seems to be about 3 general grades of battery on sale in the UK last time I looked with
3, 4 or 5 years warranty. So the more you spend the longer the warranty :lol:
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i didn't know about 3,4 and 5 year warranty's. I've had mostly 2 year warranty's on new replacement battery's I've bought. maybee i should have spent a little more money. :eek:
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most have 12 month warranty... except honda who do a pro rata thing, if it breaks in the first year they replace it free, breaks in the 2nd year they pay half you pay half for a replacement...
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Had a battery with 2 year warranty go after 23 months.
Just showed receipt and fitted a new one
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lucky!!!
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lucky!!!
I was expecting a bit of a fight at the shop but No they just replaced. No argument.
Unfortunately they wouldn't give me a receipt for another 2 years on the new battery.
So that one was only warranted for 1 month !
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I hope to get at least 5 years life from mine :D
Done 48,000 miles (same 28 months old) and still powers my USB stick just great ;)
Hey John, have you got a battery problem?
Hi Steve, thanks for reply, no battery problem, BUT i always like to get an idea how long i can expect, as the new cars rely on battery power.
mybe australian conditions are harder on batterys? no one here garantee a battery longer than 3 years at the most. average garantee is 2 years
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I guess a battery is the easiest of bits to replace, but can often let you down when you least expect :rolleyes: as I found out with my Mrs' various cars over the years :rolleyes: .
... as the new cars rely on battery power...
I guess some all cars rely on this most of the time :P :P :P
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i wonder if the lagging helps the battery... i know they dont like the cold, and thats what usually kills them!
i get free batteries, so i dont care how long it lasts LOL
i should move next door LOL
my last two cars were work horses one was a 6 cylinder falcon, i was averaging 60,000 to 70,000k per year the 6 cylinder ford ute's battery went in two years.
then after three years i sold that Ute got a new V8 ford ute, that battery lasted one year.
my motor bikes Batterys last a long time now as they use AGM type looks like the Hy battery,
i always thought cold weather was hard on batterys too, but i think it's heat that can kill them, i think because i did a lot of driving the battery was always hot. i saw a bike battery cook in 50C temps in the outback once. some cars have fans to cool there batterys.
thanks for everyones reply's. i'll just keep checking mine as less than 11volt and they can't power the ECU
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I've never had a car battery last less than 5 years. Usually fail on 5th or 6th winter. And none of the previous cars had lagging on the battery like the i30 does.
Lorian could you explain what lagging is thanks?
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I guess a battery is the easiest of bits to replace, but can often let you down when you least expect :rolleyes: as I found out with my Mrs' various cars over the years :rolleyes: .
... as the new cars rely on battery power...
I guess some all cars rely on this most of the time :P :P :P
That's so true Steve! ( batterys letting u down when least expect it )
Old Diesels can run with no battery if they are runing, you just need the battery to power the starter motor, but our modern diesels use electronic injection so need the battery to have over 11 volts i think.
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Hi John,
Lagging usually relates to a layer of insulation around something like when they tape foam or felt around outside water pipes.. I've never notice anything around our battery (but I'm not always an observant person) :rolleyes:
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Yup thats lagging. My battery came from production with a little jacket all around it. Never seen the like before. Could just be the european-sourced batteries.
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Yup thats lagging. My battery came from production with a little jacket all around it. Never seen the like before. Could just be the european-sourced batteries.
I still haven't had a chance to check under my bonnet but agent is in Brisbane Australia and he mentioned the lagging too I think... :cool:
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I didn't notice any lagging on my battery but I did note it was bigger than the piddly little ones we usually see on the Japanese cars. And it's got a good cold cranking rating.
Anyway, I'm sure it's heat which kills batteries. Pretty normal for them to go in 2-4 years in Oz.
Don't they suggest you keep spare torch batteries in the fridge to lengthen their shelf life?
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Never tried battery in the fridge b4, but they say don't store car battery,s on concrete put them on wood.
my battery has like a hard plastic or ruberized case that seems to have room to circulate air. looks to me a bit like the aussie Fords get. Holdens get there Battery in the boot .
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I once stored a new motorbike battery in a fridge. It was well-wrapped and taped. I suppose my first ex-wife was a bit of a sport about it.
My partner told her fellow-workers about it and it divided the staff! :lol: :D
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I didn't mean store car batteries in the fridge :eek:
However, I found this on Yahoo. Interesting about the Nimh type as I'm often complaining about them losing their charge too quickly.
We searched on "batteries freezer" and also looked at several battery manufacturer's web sites to find the answer to this question. The search results led to a very detailed frequently asked questions (FAQ) page about AA and AAA cell batteries, as well as its related battery myths page that provided a plethora of information about batteries.
According to these sources, storing batteries in the freezer (or refrigerator) will make them last longer, but it depends on what kind of battery you're using. And in the long run, it may not be worth the hassle.
For alkaline batteries (the most common kind of household battery), putting them in the freezer will extend their shelf life by less than 5%. And cold batteries can't be used immediately -- you have to wait until they've warmed up to room temperature first. If you need those batteries for a flashlight in an emergency, this could prove problematic. When stored at room temperature, alkaline batteries retain 90% of their power, and the average shelf life of alkaline batteries is five to seven years.
For NiMH and Nicad batteries (often used for electronics), storing them in the freezer might be more practical. These kinds of batteries lose their charge after a few days when kept at room temperature. But they'll retain a 90% charge for months if you store them in the freezer. Just like alkaline batteries, you'll need to wait until they've warmed up before using them. However, this isn't a problem when you need new batteries for your digital camera or other electronic gadget.
Battery manufacturers tend to agree. Kodak says "refrigeration is not necessary, nor is it recommended" and "freezing is not recommended" for its alkaline batteries. Duracell advises: "Do not refrigerate Duracell batteries. This will not make them last longer." Both recommend storing batteries in a cool, dry place.
Actually, the last sentence seems to back up earlier observations that car batteries last longer in cold climes.
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I've had a battery loose it charge both in the summer and the winter.
Winter I can understand as it works that little bit harder to turn the engine over.
Summer must be to do with excess use of the blower to keep cool!
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Yup that's lagging. My battery came from production with a little jacket all around it. Never seen the like before. Could just be the european-sourced batteries.
the insulation on a modern cars battery isn't just to keep it cool or warm but also to eliminate as much debris flying around from the battery in a collision.
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i wouldnt like a face full of acid!!!
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The packing is there to protect the battery from the weather either too hot or cold.
Changes in weather/temperature/humidity all have a effect on the battery contents so by having the jacket help, so the theory goes, to stabilise battery contents.
Also, if you look it keeps the battery nice and snug, just like a warm winter coat. :lol:
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i had a battery blow up on me once, was an old acid type they had screw in cell caps that never had a breather hole, they had a hose at one end that was acid overflow & breather, the hose somehow got blocked, battery could not breath and it exploded under me @ 70mph ( on a Harley ) was lucky i never got acid on me but i could smell this strong acid smell, bike was still runing ok too .
that jacket could be for that reason too, but AGM batterys use Absorbed Glass mat that hold the acid, works a bit like a foam filled fuel cell. i like them they last longer too.
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I've had a battery loose it charge both in the summer and the winter.
Winter I can understand as it works that little bit harder to turn the engine over.
Summer must be to do with excess use of the blower to keep cool!
Batteries only lose their charge when something goes wrong inside, normally - like a buckled plate which often happens when the fluid drops too low and there's a fair bit of dry plate exposed. There's no fixing that.
BUT! If you don't keep the top of the battery clean AND DRY, the charge will leak out across the top of the battery to earth and they can go flat very quickly. I you put a voltmeter on the positive terminal and the other clip just onto the top of the battery (away from the negative terminal) you'll be amazed at the amount of leakage.
Because a car can be harder to start in winter, a battery with low charge will flatten more quicly than in summer.
Then, if you have the time, it's only a matter of cleaning off the top of the battery and clamps and recharging it and you're off again.
Simple hot water from a bucket will generally dissolve all the grime (but don't do it over concrete) and a quick hose off afterwards to ensure there's no nasty acid floating around inside your engine bay.
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I'm pretty sure mines a sealed-for-life battery. I always cover the terminals completely with vaseline petroleum jelly.
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I'm pretty sure mines a sealed-for-life battery. I always cover the terminals completely with vaseline petroleum jelly.
If they are like the ones we have here, you can peel off the flat cover and still top them up. An RACQ guy showed me that some years ago. He was right. The electrolyte level was down below the top of the plates. We topped it up and the battery kept going for another couple of years.
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Thats worth knowing. I haven't looked closely at the i30 battery.
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Just had a quick look under the bonnet. I can't even work out how to get the cover off the top of the battery (but I'm working on it).
The handbook says we have a "maintenance free, calcium based battery".
I have never even heard of calcium based batteries so did some ggogling.
I found this in a caravan forum.
Calcium batteries are excellent cranking batteries, and that is their purpose of function. To charge calcium batteries to anything like a full charge you need a specialist calcium battery charger. An ordinary battery charger will normally/generally get a calcium battery to around 50% and if you are lucky a maximum of 65% capacity.
Can anyone give us more info on calcium batteries.
Another new learning curve..... :cool:
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you need a c-tek charger to charge them properly... ill ask dad about calcium batteries and calcium-calcium batteries (there are 2 types of calcium battery)
i think one has calcium coated plates... the other doesnt
weird i know, but ill offer you this DONT let it get flat, because you will need the right charger...
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I know nothing of this type of battery but getting 50% charge (from normal charger) would surely be more than adequate. The car's system would take over from here.
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Is this for ALL batteries on our cars or just certain markets?
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Never had a calcium battery b4, but i have a C-Tec charger i use it on my harley. it has an AGM battery and i like them a lot.
Surferdude just do a google to find your local Battery world they are the best place to learn about battery's. i got my C-Tec charger there best charger i've owned yet.
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I know nothing of this type of battery but getting 50% charge (from normal charger) would surely be more than adequate. The car's system would take over from here.
no... if your missus gave you 50% in bed, how would you feel?
if a normal charger cant charge it properly, the car's system cant either, hence why you need a proper charger
your car can keep it charged AS LONG as you drive it often... i dont drive the maxima often (sometimes goes 4+ weeks with out a drive) and when the battery went almost flat i took it for a massive 300km drive... and it still started VERY slowly
charged it properly and it started good
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Never had a calcium battery b4, but i have a C-Tec charger i use it on my harley. it has an AGM battery and i like them a lot.
Surferdude just do a google to find your local Battery world they are the best place to learn about battery's. i got my C-Tec charger there best charger i've owned yet.
I'm going to talk to Century Batteries tomorrow. They supply our stores and I note in their catalogue they refer to calcium based batteries and also the need to know what type of battery you have so you know you have the correct charger. I'm a bit miffed because it seems they haven't been upgrading our staff knowledge as none of them know about calcium batteries.
Tre
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I know nothing of this type of battery but getting 50% charge (from normal charger) would surely be more than adequate. The car's system would take over from here.
if a normal charger cant charge it properly, the car's system cant either, hence why you need a proper charger
Interesting. I did a bit of research to check out the subtle differences between calcium lead-acid batteries and normal lead-acid batteries to work out why my long held belief would not apply here and find that not only are you correct about calcium batteries but this can also be applied to normal lead-acid batteries as well. The voltage from a normal regulated alternator may indeed be insufficient to fully recharge a significantly flattened battery given normal driving habits, irrespective of type.
In practice I guess the, perhaps say, 50-80% charge may prove adequate and hide the true charge unless you check the specific gravity. In the old days many car owners had a hydrometer in the tool kit. I certainly did and checked the charge regularly to extend the battery's life as long as possible. Not only was distilled water added but on a very rare occasion, acid. Purchasing a new battery would be a significant cost. The prosperity we enjoy today with relatively enormous disposable incomes was just a dream and wastage through neglect was unacceptable, particularly for the generation that experienced the depression of the 1930s and/or the rationioning during WWII. No... I wasn't there for either of these significant events (only just though). :wink: :rolleyes:
I might add that a home charger was also a common tool for a DYI owner (and they were many more than today as well) and was used much more than would be the case today. Before alternators were "generators" and without going into the difference it will suffice to say that they were not nearly as good and poorly charged batteries were not uncommon.
It was the advent of almost perfect charging systems when alternators and solid state regulators replaced the crappy generators and electro-mechanical regulators that relegated significant battery maintenance to history. And now you don't even have to add water. How easy is that? :cool:
I still use a hydrometer, as I guess a few here do, for checking beer wort. :cool:
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The old d.c. dynamo's had a regulated output flucatuating 13.8/15.6 volts, depending on the requirements.
The alternators are a.c. multiphase, but output d.c., similar voltage.
If a battery is fully discharged, a slightly higher pressure (voltage) and flow (amperes) is needed to overcome the high internal resistance of the cells i.e. "to start it off", it can then be "trickle charged". That is why, sometimes "a kick up the backside", can replenish a discharged battery, that would appear "unchargeable".
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I've got together a fair bit of info on this topic and spoken to the technical people at Century.
Also Supercharge is a mine of information.
I'll collate it tomorrow and post up here in summary form.
In short, not as big an issue as first thought.
Trev
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Don't try that on the new RACQ batteries They are sealed for the life of the battery They(and a lot of other brands ) have a indicaor which shows if battery is discharged and needs charging or replace it
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Hi all, hope this makes sense.
Automotive Batteries
Car batteries are still basically of the “wet” type.
This means (generally) a plastic body with lead plates suspended and separated from one another in an acid bath. Some have caps through which you can top up the electrolyte with distilled water. More recent ones are Maintenance Free (MF) and are sealed or semi-sealed.
Recent developments have seen the antimony component of the plates, replaced with a calcium alloy, initially on the negative plates, then on both. The first stage resulted in reduced gassing and thereby water consumption. When they went to calcium-calcium, the benefit was up to 80% less fluid loss. They also self-discharge much more slowly, extending shelf life from a month or two to almost a year.
The downside to this is that if a battery is seriously over-discharged (read “bloody flat”), recharging becomes more difficult. But not impossible. The use of commonly available “multi stage” chargers overcomes this by charging through a 3, 4 or even 5 step process which, if done correctly can take up to 8 hours but will result in a good performing battery again.
The in-car charging systems in today’s cars are designed to suit the type of battery fitted as OE so care should be taken to replace like for like. However, most are calcium-calcium and most replacement options are the same.
If you are so inclined, you can buy a top class, multi-stage charger in Australia for less than $100and it will have both clamp and eyelet connections (motor cycle batteries etc).
The latest technology is known as Valve Regulated Lead Acid (VRLA) and features two types. These are GEL and AGM (Vlies). In the first the acid is chemically gelled or gelatinised. The second, AGM, or Absorbed Glass Mat uses a fibreglass mat which acts like a sponge to achieve the same aim – no free fluid acid. It is these two types for which a “traditional” charger should not be used. And this caution has been extended incorrectly to include calcium based batteries.
Some Battery Myths.
• Storing a battery on a concrete floor will discharge it. Not true and may well be the opposite as evidence suggests that it is temperature (heat) which accelerates discharge rates.
• You can fully charge a “dead” battery by simply driving. Untrue and may in extreme cases damage your car’s charging system through overheating. For a dead flat battery, use an external charger.
• A battery will not lose charge during storage. Untrue. NB. A battery stored at 35C will self discharge TWICE as fast as on stored at 24C..
• On really cold days, turn on your headlights to warm up the battery before starting your engine (one for our northern hemisphere cousins). Wrong. The capacity consumed while doing this is better used starting the engine.
• Car batteries last longer in hot climates than in cold ones. Untrue. Car batteries last on average two thirds as long as batteries in cold ones. Heat kills batteries and cold reduces the battery’s starting capacity.
Produced with information from Century Batteries Australia, CTEK Battery Chargers and Supercharge Batteries. The summary above is my own interpretation of the various points of information, written, I hope in an understandable manner.
Trev
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Makes good sense thanks Trev .. Great post :mrgreen:
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The insulation around the battery is part number 37112 and the description for it is indeed "Insulation pad".