[rustynutz]

3.  Another safety feature, but one I am not quite so sure about as it creates a pet hate of mine, is the brake lights.  When AutoHold is on, you draw up to a junction and stop and the handbrake automatically applies itself.  The brake lights remain on until you move forward again, they do not switch off when you remove your foot from the pedal, as would be normal for instance atvtraffic lights.  This is something which although safe, I find that I hate being behind a car, particularly in the wet, with its brake lights glaring into my windscreen, but I guess since mine now does it for me, I will have to be more tolerant of vehicles in front of me as they may also have this feature.

Surely this is no different to keeping your foot on the brake pedal while stopped anyhow? 

[Shambles]

Surely this is no different to keeping your foot on the brake pedal while stopped anyhow? 

Another pet hate of mine - yet modern SOMs teach it as "good practise"

[bumpkin]

Surely this is no different to keeping your foot on the brake pedal while stopped anyhow? 

Another pet hate of mine - yet modern SOMs teach it as "good practise"

When I was taught to drive the practice of sitting with your foot on the brake was completely frowned upon, and indeed upon checking our road use advice still is, check rule 114.....

http://www.direct.gov.uk/en/TravelAndTransport/Highwaycode/DG_070302

Many of the features can be configured from the dashboard, such as the active locking system, follow me home lights etc, but I have not seen anything about stop lights.  I am aware that many manufacturers are now fitting this as standard, I guess it is something we have to get used to much like the flashing hazard / stop lights when emergency braking, I was taught that hazard signals were ONLY to be used when broken down, to alert other users that you were stationary due to a problem, not for showing that you are braking hard or fancy parking on double yellow lines because you can't be arsed walking to the the bank/newsagent/whatever.

[bumpkin]

Another check I have made is that the swivel turning bulbs are available only on the Premium model when purchased with the optional vision pack, a "standard" Premium has the static bulbs just like mine.

[rustynutz]

Surely this is no different to keeping your foot on the brake pedal while stopped anyhow? 

Another pet hate of mine - yet modern SOMs teach it as "good practise"

When I was taught to drive the practice of sitting with your foot on the brake was completely frowned upon, and indeed upon checking our road use advice still is, check rule 114.....

Well, I'm guilty of doing it....guess it's a result of riding motorcycles and always keeping a brake applied while stopped.
Makes sense to me because if you get rear ended at least you've already got the brakes on which hopefully prevents you being pushed into an intersection or such.

[Doggie 1]

I tend to agree and I do it also, although it is contrary to how I was taught.
I was always taught to get my foot off the pedal ASAP but I think that was more a certain govt department not wanting to replace pads.

[bumpkin]

Surely this is no different to keeping your foot on the brake pedal while stopped anyhow? 

Another pet hate of mine - yet modern SOMs teach it as "good practise"

When I was taught to drive the practice of sitting with your foot on the brake was completely frowned upon, and indeed upon checking our road use advice still is, check rule 114.....

Well, I'm guilty of doing it....guess it's a result of riding motorcycles and always keeping a brake applied while stopped.
Makes sense to me because if you get rear ended at least you've already got the brakes on which hopefully prevents you being pushed into an intersection or such.

I'll push my neck out here and state that just because some folk are "guilty of doing it", it does not make it correct.  Whilst it may be different on a motorbike (and I will bow to the experts on that) if you are at a junction in a car and have applied the handbrake, you do have the brakes on to prevent you being pushed.  It could be argued that excessive glare from stopped vehicles caused the rear ending perhaps?

[Surferdude]

I have to admit glare from brake lights is a particularly annoying to me too. I believe if you're in an automatic it's difficult not to do it. To take your foot off the brake at lights you have to at least take it out of drive and probably apply the handbrake.
That's all a bit messy.
But I also believe a lot of modern cars have much brighter (and larger area) brake lights than necessary.
You can see it in traffic. Some of them actually hurt your eyes.

[Phil №❶]

Have to disagree with just about everyone here I'm afraid. In an auto, it's necessary to have the brake applied, unless you want to roll into the dude in front. Taking the car out of gear is unsafe IMO. There are standards for light brilliance in all countries and if there is a lot of glare then they're doing their job, they are warning lights after all. I don't think that too much glare is an acceptable excuse for rear ending anyone. In afternoon conditions, with the sun shining, they're can be just adequate. I've done the mod on both cars and make no apology for that.

[Dazzler]

Have to disagree with just about everyone here I'm afraid. In an auto, it's necessary to have the brake applied, unless you want to roll into the dude in front. Taking the car out of gear is unsafe IMO.

 

[bumpkin]

I would disagree with that too though.

I was taught in a manual that you approach the junction, stop with the footbrake, apply the handbrake and put the vehicle into neutral whilst waiting. Then into first, disable the handbrake and away.

Surely in an auto the procedure is just the same??  Stop, handbrake, N, D, handbrake, continue??

[Dazzler]

As i've mentioned before our Traffic  lights don't need to stay on Red very long in Tassie due to light traffic so I heve got into the habit of leaving my car in drive and foot on the brake.

This is only the 2nd auto I've owned and probably the fourth I've driven regularly - had a couple of Auto Company cars.

I thought it was normal to leave in drive with foot on the brake 

[Phil №❶]

Nope, it's always been select & forget for me. Might as well drive a manual if you're going to do that at each stop. Last thing I want to think about when some moron is heading for m,e out of control, is selecting "D"!

[bumpkin]

Obviously just the difference between territories.

As Steve and I have stated (and I have linked to) it would appear that despite it being a road rule in the UK, it is increasingly being disregarded and with the advent of the new systems will have to be a rule which is omitted in the future.  I do wonder if I was to come against a particularly jobsworthy cop what the outcome would be though

[Dazzler]

Hey Brian I am about to hit the sack but I answered a couple of your comments in that road test thread 

[eye30]

I was taught in a manual that you approach the junction, stop with the footbrake, apply the handbrake and put the vehicle into neutral whilst waiting. Then into first, disable the handbrake and away.

I was taught that and still do it 42.9 years later.

It really annoys me when the car(s) in front of me are displaying their red brake lights then when they move off they jerk/don't do it with a smooth motion

[Doggie 1]

I was taught in a manual that you approach the junction, stop with the footbrake, apply the handbrake and put the vehicle into neutral whilst waiting. Then into first, disable the handbrake and away.

I was taught that and still do it 42.9 years later.

It really annoys me when the car(s) in front of me are displaying their red brake lights then when they move off they jerk/don't do it with a smooth motion

How many people have smooth motions? 

[rustynutz]

I'll push my neck out here and state that just because some folk are "guilty of doing it", it does not make it correct.  Whilst it may be different on a motorbike (and I will bow to the experts on that) if you are at a junction in a car and have applied the handbrake, you do have the brakes on to prevent you being pushed.  It could be argued that excessive glare from stopped vehicles caused the rear ending perhaps?

Pretty sure there's nothing in our Aussie road laws requiring it so I guess "downunder" it is "correct" as such...   

Oh, and the handbrake only operates on the rear brakes so is not gonna be as effective as having all the brakes applied.

As Steve and I have stated (and I have linked to) it would appear that despite it being a road rule in the UK, it is increasingly being disregarded and with the advent of the new systems will have to be a rule which is omitted in the future.  I do wonder if I was to come against a particularly jobsworthy cop what the outcome would be though

I'd just like to point out that they used the word "should" in that UK road rule which, to me means it's more of a "suggestion"....

[rustynutz]

How many people have smooth motions? 

I do.... 

[Phil №❶]

How many people have smooth motions? 

I do.... 

TMI 

[eye30]

I'd just like to point out that they used the word "should" in that UK road rule which, to me means it's more of a "suggestion"....

Correct

In English grammar 'should' is used for giving advice, such as in the Highway Code:

examples of such use:
•You should speak to him about it.
•He should see a doctor.
•We should ask a lawyer.

Other uses of "should":

'Should' can also be used to give an opinion or a recommendation.

•He should resign now.
•We should invest more in Asia.
•They should do something about this terrible train service.

'Should' can be used to express a personal opinion and is much weaker and more personal than 'must' or 'have to'. It is often introduced by ' I think'.

•I think they should replace him.
•I don't think they should keep the contract.
•Do you think we should tell her.

[Shambles]

In English grammar 'should' is used for giving advice, such as in the Highway Code:

examples of such use:
•You should speak to him about it.
•He should see a doctor.
•We should ask a lawyer.

Other uses of "should":

'Should' can also be used to give an opinion or a recommendation.

•He should resign now.
•We should invest more in Asia.
•They should do something about this terrible train service.

'Should' can be used to express a personal opinion and is much weaker and more personal than 'must' or 'have to'. It is often introduced by ' I think'.

•I think they should replace him.
•I don't think they should keep the contract.
•Do you think we should tell her.

I think you should quit while you're ahead

[beerman]

You gents must have sensitive eyes...I do a truckload of night driving and cannot say it has ever been an issue for me.

I think the handbrake on at lights provides a few limitations.

Firstly it limits the ability to roll forward should you identify that someone behind you won't stop in time.

Secondly if they do shunt you in the rear, with the handbrake on, ABS will not be activated when the vehicle starts moving, giving you impaired ability to regain control over the vehicle and perhaps steer to avoid an object.

Handbrake on to me suggests mind in neutral, hands off the wheel, as you are no longer exercising control over the vehicle. For mine, this should only be the case when you reach your destination and are about to exit the vehicle.

[Phil №❶]

Yes 

[rustynutz]

Thanks lester....

You gents must have sensitive eyes...I do a truckload of night driving and cannot say it has ever been an issue for me.

I think the handbrake on at lights provides a few limitations.

Firstly it limits the ability to roll forward should you identify that someone behind you won't stop in time.

Secondly if they do shunt you in the rear, with the handbrake on, ABS will not be activated when the vehicle starts moving, giving you impaired ability to regain control over the vehicle and perhaps steer to avoid an object.

Handbrake on to me suggests mind in neutral, hands off the wheel, as you are no longer exercising control over the vehicle. For mine, this should only be the case when you reach your destination and are about to exit the vehicle.

I agree with you, beerman! 

I can't recall ever having a problem with glare from standard brake lights.....

Maybe our pommy friends have sensitive eyes from all those drab days they have to suffer through? 

[eye30]

I can't recall ever having a problem with glare from standard brake lights.....

Maybe our pommy friends have sensitive eyes from all those drab days they have to suffer through? 

Is it me but here in UK the red light emitted from the brake lights seems to have become brighter over the last few years.

I take it that there is a "European/international" standard of the maximum light emitted but to me when new models are launched the lights seem to be brighter...

At night it is really dazzling an "so in your face" and even in the daylight they are so intense.

[eye30]

I think you should quit while you're ahead

Not much happening at the moment as I've had a tidy out in the garage while waiting for the insurance to get back re when they will be rebuilding...  so at a loose end today...

[Dazzler]

I think you should quit while you're ahead

Not much happening at the moment as I've had a tidy out in the garage while waiting for the insurance to get back re when they will be rebuilding...  so at a loose end today...

We noticed..

[Surferdude]

Yes 

I also agree except for the part about the brake lights. They are definitely brighter than they used to be (some noticeably more than others and IIRC it's Euro cars which are the culprits.

[rustynutz]

Here in OZ brake lights have to comply with Australian Design Rules which stipulate minimum and maximum intensities so you'd wonder how European car brake lights would be any brighter...