[rustynutz]

.. in fact our Safetycrats frown on the idea of our drivers doing an advanced driving course...

Do you have a reference for this fact? I have to say, that doesn't sound right to me, if only because I'd give "them" more credit than that.

Can't remember where exactly, but I have come across references to it on quite a few occasions......... :-\

I do suspect their source was this though:

http://www.monash.edu.au/cemo/roadsafety/abstracts_and_papers/001/CHRISTIE_DRIVER_PAPER.pdf

.. in fact our Safetycrats frown on the idea of our drivers doing an advanced driving course...

Do you have a reference for this fact? I have to say, that doesn't sound right to me, if only because I'd give "them" more credit than that.

Can't remember where exactly, but I have come across references to it on quite a few occasions......... :-\

I do suspect their source was this though:

http://www.monash.edu.au/cemo/roadsafety/abstracts_and_papers/001/CHRISTIE_DRIVER_PAPER.pdf

I might have missed it but it sounded like their conclusion was that it didn't help, not that it was discouraged because it made things worse. Anyway, I'm sure some of these studies still get it wrong.

Improving a driver's skill beyond that which is (deemed) acceptable to gain a license might offer less return on investment than other options (whatever they are) but I just can't see it having a negative impact on safety.

[rustynutz]

I might have missed it but it sounded like their conclusion was that it didn't help, not that it was discouraged because it made things worse. Anyway, I'm sure some of these studies still get it wrong.

I found the following comment in the report: 

There is also considerable evidence that driver training that attempts to impart advanced skills such as skid control may contribute to increased crash risk, particularly among young males.

I might have missed it but it sounded like their conclusion was that it didn't help, not that it was discouraged because it made things worse. Anyway, I'm sure some of these studies still get it wrong.

I found the following comment in the report:  

There is also considerable evidence that driver training that attempts to impart advanced skills such as skid control may contribute to increased crash risk, particularly among young males.

Ok, missed that, thanks.

Perhaps I can understand that happening in the short term as these new found skills are honed but in the long term I think it must help so I'd need to be convinced that their data was both gathered and analysed properly to constitute "considerable evidence".

The process of learning to drive is like a toddler learning to walk. They will fall over more while learning to walk/drive but if given sufficient encouragement and exposure to the activity they will learn how not to fall over for the rest of their lives. Imagine if we artificially limited toddlers to only learning to walk slowly, never allowing them to run, walk sideways or backwards or turn around, in the pretext that we were reducing their chances of "crashing". Such protectiveness would of course be misdirected.

Any pilots here?  Before you are allowed to solo you will be taught and must demonstrate your ability to recognise incipient stalls and how to avoid and recover from stalls and spins. Surely noone would say that such advanced techniques are unnecessary. Perhaps pilots would be better off not learning such things and only flew at an altitude where crashes won't kill them. Even if that were possible it is still preposterous of course.

[rustynutz]

I agree with everything you're saying, pip....

It's also concerned me for years that kids learn to drive in modern cars with ABS and are able to brake hard by just stomping on the brake pedal then go out and buy an old car without ABS, find themselves in a situation, stomp on the brake and find they are locked up and skidding off the road or into the path of another vehicle.

Our Anti Hoon laws don't help the situation either, when I was young and was wanting to hone my skills, I went out on some deserted dirt roads and practised emergency braking and car control etc. Do it now and you're liable to lose both car and licence.

[snowcherry]

Northbound opposite the Wild Horse Mountain Lookout and on the last rise before the drop down to the Caloundra turnoff. They would have been there on your last trip. The hardware went up about the middle of last year or earlier.

don't recall seeing anything like that. is it near the other fixed camera?
not sure what the Lookout is. will have to google it i guess.

[Surferdude]

Northbound opposite the Wild Horse Mountain Lookout and on the last rise before the drop down to the Caloundra turnoff. They would have been there on your last trip. The hardware went up about the middle of last year or earlier.

don't recall seeing anything like that. is it near the other fixed camera?
not sure what the Lookout is. will have to google it i guess.

There's 2 service stations opposite one another, think they're Mobil.
An overpass between the two. And the camera is set up just through the overpass (looks just like a fixed camera) and this one and the one just before the Caloundra turnoff are the only ones north of Caboolture. The original (single) fixed camera is near the Burpengary weighbridge, well south of here.

[snowcherry]

ahh definitely know the Mobils. sometimes stop there.
ok cheers i know where to look for it now.

but there must be another one for it to be point to point. ??

[Surferdude]

ahh definitely know the Mobils. sometimes stop there.
ok cheers i know where to look for it now.

but there must be another one for it to be point to point. ??

Northbound opposite the Wild Horse Mountain Lookout and on the last rise before the drop down to the Caloundra turnoff. They would have been there on your last trip. The hardware went up about the middle of last year or earlier.

don't recall seeing anything like that. is it near the other fixed camera?
not sure what the Lookout is. will have to google it i guess.

There's 2 service stations opposite one another, think they're Mobil.
An overpass between the two. And the camera is set up just through the overpass (looks just like a fixed camera) and this one and the one just before the Caloundra turnoff are the only ones north of Caboolture. The original (single) fixed camera is near the Burpengary weighbridge, well south of here.