[Shambles]

I appreciate that this thread is about RegY-from-Slovenia's foglight switch, but are you Aussies saying you don't get rear foglights (or at least the switch to activate them) ?

If so, does this then mean you are allowed to drive into fog but not have fog behind you  

Sounds a bit... Mick Dundee, if you ask me

[Dazzler]

Thanks Tim...

You guessed it Shambles, no rear fogs and only a one way switch for the front fogs (as you would expect in the circumstances) I hadn't heard of rear fog lights until you guys started mentioning them and I've had around 30 different vehicles including several Company ones...

There's probably a lesson in this for us Aussies have park lights on when foggy (+ front Fogs) so no one runs up your A...s

Tim,

Don't think that fog light rule applies in Tassie? Our fogs aren't very yellow so most would probably assume the're driving lights (very poor ones..)

[TheBunyip]

Hi All,

If I remember correctly Rear Fog lights were first seen in the UK in the 1960s. I recall fitting a pair to a Morris Minor in about 1969 after I had a near miss with an idiot driving without lights in fog. That scared s#!% out of me and convinced me I should do the responsible thing. They were meant to reduce rearending during FOG. They helped some but could cause confusion with Brake Lights. So these days the theory seems to be that one rear fog light is best to avoid confusion with brake lights. One rear fog light is compulsory in Europe as a whole so far as I know while front fog lights are still optional. Few, if any, manufacturers seem to fit two rear fog lights to all models now. I cannot say I have looked to check in years.

The big problem remains getting people to turn them on when visibility falls to 150 feet/50 metres and turning them off when no longer required. Last January I drove through a blizzard on the A66 between Penrith and Scotch Corner. The use of fog Lights helped us to try to keep a safe distance from other vehicles when visibility was down to little more than a yard/metre or so.

[Lakes]

Let it be known, the best drivers in Australia are in New South Wales,   in this state we activate our 4 hazard lights daytime or night time if we find ourself in pea soup fog. we have sign's posted in area's were this can happen so people know what's going on if everyone is driving with there hazard lights all flashing. also we have a law that you can only have white light on if you are traveling in that direction, so have to be careful fitting any type of rear light. but you see some with white driving lights on the rear to use for reversing, specially in country area's, but they should not have a switch they should only come on when you use reverse. out in the country at night it can be black!!! so need good reverse lighting.

[LuciferDarklord]

The Getz my wife used to have was fitted with rear fog lights, and so is her Tucson.  I got pulled over by the cops once driving her Tucson for having the front fog lights switched on - i must have bumped the switch and didnt realise they were on.  The cops let me off with a warning, especially when I told them about the idiot I had just seen towing a horse float with no lights on all over the road and running up and down the curb, obviously extremely pissed.

[Dazzler]

The earlier Getz over here and the Excel as well used to have what I thought was a red reflector mounted low on the back Bumper (because there was only one it looked a bit odd and used to annoy my wife when she saw one as she likes symmetry) I guess they were actually a fog light ... learn something every day..

[LuciferDarklord]

The Tucson has them integrated into the cluster.  Can see how they can get confused with brake lights if they are left on unintentionally, they are very bright.

[RegY]

they use the same type and strenth (Watts) bulbs as brakelights too - 21W

[donc]

Hi guys,

I’m a licensed mechanic, member of the Institute of Automotive Mechanical Engineers, and a NSW RTA vehicle inspector (Roads & Traffic Authority). I was also on the committee tasked with evaluating emergency vehicle lighting systems during bushfire smoke back in the early ‘90’s (it was our conclusions that led to fire vehicles having one red and one blue light) - No longer work in the profession but can offer a few ‘historic’ thoughts on this –

Fog lights are designed to improve the visibility of your vehicle to other traffic during periods of restricted visibility (fog, smoke etc.); ie to make it easier for other people to see you coming. They are not designed to help you see any better during fog although under some circumstances this can be a side-benefit. Fog lights must be designed/fitted so as to only illuminate the lower ground immediately in front of the vehicle. This is to reduce the Tindall Effect (reflection) experienced when using lights angled at a higher level (headlights) during fog.

The use of DRL’s (daytime running lights) is permitted and encouraged however fog lights do not qualify as DRL’s.The use of fog lights during periods of unrestricted visibility (no fog or smoke etc.) is illegal in NSW. The only currently approved DRL’s are parkers (side lights) and low-beam headlights.

The reason you can only turn-on your fog lights with the parkers (side) lights or headlights on is so your rear lights are activated whenever the fog lights are on. It is illegal to have fog lights wired independently of the vehicle lighting system (you cannot have fog lights able to be turned-on while all other lights are off) for the simple reason the back of your vehicle would not be illuminated.

Rear fog lights are not approved for use in NSW (at least they weren’t a few years ago; I’m not sure if this has changed) for reason that drivers can easily mistake them for brake lights. Nonetheless the Hyundai Excel was one vehicle sold pre-fitted with a single rear fog light – I understand this (and a few other vehicle models) were allowed an exemption for the rear light.

[TheBunyip]

Hi All,

Donc makes some interesting points. What surprises me is that so far I cannot find any information on experiments to find the best way to provide effective Rear Fog Lighting that will not be confused with Brake lights. I am not convinced that one rear fog light is confusion free.  As the use of High Level Rear Brake lights has cut accidents I wonder if something like two rear fog lights mounted centrally, one high and one low, would be needed to avoid confusion. On the other hand  it  could easily turn the rear of our cars into ugly Christmas Trees.

Lighting might just be about to get even more interesting... or confusing... or frustrating.

The Scandinavian countries were ,I think, (put me right if wrong   ) the first to insist on Daylight Running Lighting on all the time. It has proved a significant life saver and has been verified by more research across Europe. So much so that we are likely to see it becoming compulsory for new cars in Europe in the not too distant future.

Osram have even developed a special bulb/lamp/globe for the market. Their web sites show some interesting demonstration of the value of DLR's. You can see what they have to say here. http://www.osram.co.uk/osram_com/Consumer/Automotive_Lighting/See_and_be_seen/LIGHTDAY/index.html

Not everyone in the UK is happy about the development. As a self preservation measure UK Motor Bike riders have long used daytime Dipped Beams to try to indicate their presence to other motorists who "Just do not see motor bikes" and so collide with them with tragic results. A sad fact recorded consistently in Police Accident reports. Many UK Bike Riders are afraid that the use of DLRs on all cars will just blur motor bikes into the background and loose any safety advantage they have had up to now.

Perhaps with a desire to reduce power usage/CO2 emission on all vehicles we might see more use of LED lighting rather than the current Incandescent tungsten model.

[donc]

The Scandinavian countries were ,I think, (put me right if wrong  ) the first to insist on Daylight Running Lighting on all the time. It has proved a significant life saver and has been verified by more research across Europe. So much so that we are likely to see it becoming compulsory for new cars in Europe in the not too distant future.

Hi Bunyip,

I don't doubt that Scandinavians were probably the first to do this - their topography and climate is well suited to DRL's. Here in Aus the NSW Blue Mountains is littered with signs saying "turn your lights on in daytime for safety" for similar reasons (mountainous, fog-prone, and an area nearly the size of some small countries).

The other side of the coin is analysis suggesting our wildlife (mostly kangaroos and wombat's), who are most active pre-dusk, can be attracted to and/or frozen in the middle of the road by DRL's - The jury is still out however there is some evidence to suggest correlation and an increase in accidents - Also the 'mirage' effect of dazzle from fog and low-beam lights on dead-straight dry country roads is the reason our road-trains and other large road users tend not to have their lights on in daytime. It can be quite distracting to oncoming traffic.

Definitely a tough question this one... and leads me to another question... anyone know of a good Roo-Bar for the i30 ?