[eye30]

The future is here now..................

http://uk.news.yahoo.com/pilotless-passenger-planes-to-take-first-test-flights-over-uk-143538850.html

A few days from now, a Jetstream aircraft will take off from an airfield in Warton, Lancashire - and then the pilots will take their hands off the controls.

The pilots will be racks of computers which can steer the aircraft by themselves.

[Shambles]

I've thought up a brilliantly novel name for it.



Autopilot.


Brilliant.

[Dazzler]

 

[mjt57]

A few days from now, a Jetstream aircraft will take off from an airfield in Warton, Lancashire - and then the pilots will take their hands off the controls.

Get back to us when the pilots don't have to be on board at all,

 

And the computers can deal with malfunctions such as sudden gusts on final, or if an aircraft wanders onto the runway just before the flare, or if a bird strike forces and engine to be shut down and the aircraft still needs to climb away, do a fuel dump, if equipped, and return to land.

There are so many things that could go wrong that I wouldn't want a computer or even a remote controlled pilot anywhere near the aircraft that I'm paxing in...

[AlanHo]

When the motor car was first invented - someone with a red flag had to walk in front because the demon car was considered to be unpredictable and dangerous.

Before some wag posts the ageist comment "you should know" - I must add it is only because I have read about it..... 

We have driverless trains and are now on the verge of having cars which drive themselves - so pilotless commercial planes are an inevitable step from the current pilotless drones.

[Dazzler]

It is a worry though. At least if the pilot is ON the plane he has an added incentive to get it down safely in the event of a catastrophe 

[Doggie 1]

Pilotless U.S. drones in the Middle East have been "piloted" by pilots back in Arizona for quite some time.

[mjt57]

We have driverless trains and are now on the verge of having cars which drive themselves - so pilotless commercial planes are an inevitable step from the current pilotless drones.

Trains are a different kettle of fish. On rails, single vehicle operation, no giving way to other trains at intersections and so on.

As for cars which drive themselves, we have that now, given the standard of driving here in Australia.

As for drones they don't carry passengers and the aircraft are dispensable.

[FatBoy]

Most modern aircraft have an advanced autopilot that requires little or no input from the pilot for the entire flight.  For example, the A320 family of aircraft (including the A319 and A321) only require the pilot to retard the throttle on landing when the autopilot tells them to.  This was only included so the pilots felt they had something to do.  The rest of the time, from take off to landing, the aircraft is handled by the autopilot.  This includes altitude and heading changes, speed changes, traffic detection and avoidance, engine and systems monitoring and rectification.

The aircraft of the future will have only two crew up the front, a pilot and a dog.  The pilot is there to feed the dog, and the dog is there to make sure the pilot doesn't touch anything.

[Dazzler]

The aircraft of the future will have only two crew up the front, a pilot and a dog.  The pilot is there to feed the dog, and the dog is there to make sure the pilot doesn't touch anything.

 

[Surferdude]

I can hear it now.

The plane takes off smoothly, climbs to cruising height and levels out.

Pasengers then hear a recorded voice saying, "ladies and gentlemen, welcome to skyways flight #1. We are pleased to announce you are part of a history making flight here. This plane is totally flown by computer. There are no human crew on board. Intensive testing has been carried out before this flight so please sit back and enjoy the trip secure in the knowledge that nothing can go wrong...........go wrong..........go wrong.....go wro.........."

[Phil №❶]

Not for me, my feet stay on the ground these days.

[Surferdude]

Not for me, my feet stay on the ground these days.

So...........watch out for falling pilotless planes.

[Phil №❶]

STILL not safe 

[FatBoy]

The most dangerous part of any trip on an aircraft is the drive to and/or from the airport!!

[Dazzler]

Not for me, my feet stay on the ground these days.

So...........watch out for falling pilotless planes.

  (You are in great form tonight Trev .. liked your announcement too) 

[meehalych]

No pilots in the cockpit would lead to the air ticket's price reduction I assume 

from now on: an airplane may fly without pilots, but can not without technicians 

[FatBoy]

 

[AlanHo]

Most modern aircraft have an advanced autopilot that requires little or no input from the pilot for the entire flight.  For example, the A320 family of aircraft (including the A319 and A321) only require the pilot to retard the throttle on landing when the autopilot tells them to.  This was only included so the pilots felt they had something to do.  The rest of the time, from take off to landing, the aircraft is handled by the autopilot.  This includes altitude and heading changes, speed changes, traffic detection and avoidance, engine and systems monitoring and rectification.

The aircraft of the future will have only two crew up the front, a pilot and a dog.  The pilot is there to feed the dog, and the dog is there to make sure the pilot doesn't touch anything.

My son, who is a BA captain flying airbuses, tells me that the take off is done manually and the autopilot engaged at 100 feet or 5 seconds after lift-off.  He tells me that he already has the occasional "dog" with him in the right hand seat....

He is frank though that he does so little actual flying the aircraft - which is almost totally automated - that there is room for concern about a pilot's ability to repond quickly and effectively in an emergency. They are now all out of practice.  Another factor is their long and strange working hours, leading to jet lag and an almost permanent state of tiredness which he sees as an argument in favour of pilotless aircraft.

[Phil №❶]

Have to agree with Alan's son here. The lives of the people on-board the Potomac incident were saved largely by cool experience. A pilot who learned his craft totally hands on, b4 automation was invented. I know current pilots do lots of simulator training, but rarely (not sure if they're even allowed), do they fly a complete flight hands on. You can't beat hands on experience IMO.

[asathorny]

I have watched almost every episode of Air Crash Investigations and a frightening number of plane crashes are caused by simple Pilot error, zigging when they should have zagged....   I think its a bit of a distraction when the stewardess pops in with the in-flight drink wafting her boobs in their faces...   Or that could of course be stewards (not being sexist)....

Anyhow, no use worrying is it, usually your only in the one plane crash. 

I have only come close to a bowel malfunction once, we were over NewFoundland and the plane shook like a cork in a bottle for ages.......     Clean underpants required, Almost.   We landed at Gander for a check up, you should have seen the queue to the sh1thouse

[Phil №❶]

Was the stewardess delivering the in-flight drinks by any chance, Asa

[FatBoy]

Agreed totally. There is a recognised deficiency in hands on skills with modern jets (helicopters are generally hands on at all times). Conversely, most accidents with autopilots are due to the pilots not understanding the capabilities and limitations of the automated systems. Luckily, modern airline pilots have had a long road to the airlines through General Aviation where it is all hands on.

Phil, I think you mean Hudson River, not Potomac. The Potomac River accident was caused by human error (icing) in the early 80s.

[asathorny]

Was the stewardess delivering the in-flight drinks by any chance, Asa

OR... maybe the steward...    Lets not be sexist now !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Phil №❶]

Agreed totally. There is a recognised deficiency in hands on skills with modern jets (helicopters are generally hands on at all times). Conversely, most accidents with autopilots are due to the pilots not understanding the capabilities and limitations of the automated systems. Luckily, modern airline pilots have had a long road to the airlines through General Aviation where it is all hands on.

Phil, I think you mean Hudson River, not Potomac. The Potomac River accident was caused by human error (icing) in the early 80s.

Yes, absolutely correct,,,,,,, too much Xmas trifle (Sherry)   

[beerman]

I have watched almost every episode of Air Crash Investigations and a frightening number of plane crashes are caused by simple Pilot error, zigging when they should have zagged....   I think its a bit of a distraction when the stewardess pops in with the in-flight drink wafting her boobs in their faces...   Or that could of course be stewards (not being sexist)....

And most end with "if the pilot had simply done...."

[FatBoy]

Unfortunately the majority of accidents and incidents aren't caused by just one act or omission. Most have a series or chain of events, where if the chain had been broken at any stage, then the accident would not have occurred.

Think of slices of Swiss Cheese, all of the holes have to line up for an accident to happen. Rotate one slice (do something differently) or put in a solid slice (a defence mechanism) then the accident would not occur.

[Doggie 1]

Excellent analogy and one that fits motor vehicles too.
It's usually a series of events that leads to the conclusion.

[mjt57]

He is frank though that he does so little actual flying the aircraft - which is almost totally automated - that there is room for concern about a pilot's ability to repond quickly and effectively in an emergency. They are now all out of practice. 

That's what the simulator is supposed to be for - to allow them to practise emergency situations and ones that are "out of the ordinary".

A guy I know who's a captain on Qantas A380s talks about this all the time. He's also concerned that too many pilots coming through the system have so few hours, particularly the budget airlines.

[FatBoy]

If you fly budget airlines, you get budget crews.  They pay less, so they can charge their passengers less.  The guys and/or girls willing to fly for less money are the ones with the less experience.

Notwithstanding, the budget airlines are safer than the major carriers, on a "fatality per passenger mile" ratio.  The budget airlines are scrutinised more that the major carriers by the regulators.