[rustynutz]

AUSTRALIA'S largest council has been accused of imposing a curfew on blind people by turning off audible traffic signals at night.

The Brisbane City Council has angered Disability Discrimination Commissioner Graeme Innes, who's said he was stunned to learn what the council has done to satisfy CBD residents unhappy about the noise.

Mr Innes was in Brisbane at the weekend for a meeting about information services for the blind and vision impaired.

"Effectively we were on a curfew because at 9.30 at night the audible traffic signals are turned off and they don't go back on until 6.30 in the morning," he told ABC radio.

"If we were out later than that at night, or up and about before 6.30, which I often am because I take my guide dog for a walk, we didn't have the benefit of signals to cross roads."

Mr Innes says he's never come across the situation in other capital cities, and residents must know there's an element of noise associated with living in CBDs.

He also noted traffic signals contained sensors which reduced the level of sound at quiet times, such as at night.

Deputy Mayor Adrian Schrinner said signals generally were switched off in the CBD between 9.30pm and 6.30am, as part of an effort to balance the views of residents with the needs of pedestrians.

But he said the council was happy to modify the hours of operation based on requests and demand.

"Whenever we receive a request we'll do a review. In February we received a request for extended hours at about four or five CBD intersections and as a result those intersections are now operating 24-hours a day," Mr Schrinner told the ABC.

Asked why the council shouldn't have signals running around the clock, Mr Schrinner said: "It comes down to balancing the demands of use of those intersections with the concerns of residents as well".

"Where there's a need for it, where there's facilities operating late into the night, absolutely you can see the rationale for it," he said.

Source: Brisbane accused of 'curfew' on the blind | News.com.au

[Surferdude]

When we were living in Sydney, they were doing a major upgrade on Showground Rd, Castle Hill. Took over 12 months.
Because it's a major thoroughfare, all work was done at night. Hence, every time a machine or truck reversed, we were bombarded with those reversing beepers. Although we were about 200 meters from Showground Rd as the crow flies and probably 10 - 20 meters lower, the noise was horrendous. To sleep in our upstairs bedrooms you had to shut all the windows and still the noise came through. I can't imagine what it was like for the people who lived on Showground Rd.

I understand the need for audible traffic signals, but I also empathise with the concerns of residents. Those signals go off every time the lights change, yet a sight impaired person might use them once a week.
Maybe they could be wired up so they only make a noise if someone pushes the "cross" button, not in cycle with the lights regardless.

[Phil №❶]

That's a great and sensible idea Surferdude. Only sound if someone requests it, by pressing the button. I'm sure all CBD residents could live with that.

[Doggie 1]

Most people here press the button anyway then walk on the red. 
It infuriates me because all drivers then have to sit through the pedestrian cycle for no pedestrians.

[Surferdude]

Most people here press the button anyway then walk on the red. 
It infuriates me because all drivers then have to sit through the pedestrian cycle for no pedestrians.

It used to annoy me, too. Then I worked out that, if they press the button and wait for the "Walk" sign, I'd have to wait anyway, so I haven't really lost any more time either way.

[Just Rick]

Sorry but I think it's disgusting,the audible noise a light signal makes is NO WHERE near as loud as the reversing beepers,what next,lets stop emergency services using sirens between 9.30pm and 6.30am, if you want to live in the city put up with the noise.

Same as F*#*wits  that move to the country and then complain about roosters crowing,or other livestock making a noise 

[Dazzler]

Same as F*#*wits  that move to the country and then complain about roosters crowing,or other livestock making a noise 

Lucky we have double glazing or I might have been one of those.... 

[Just Rick]

Same as F*#*wits  that move to the country and then complain about roosters crowing,or other livestock making a noise 

Lucky we have double glazing or I might have been one of those.... 

 

[FatBoy]

Sorry but I think it's disgusting,the audible noise a light signal makes is NO WHERE near as loud as the reversing beepers,what next,lets stop emergency services using sirens between 9.30pm and 6.30am, if you want to live in the city put up with the noise.

Same as F*#*wits  that move to the country and then complain about roosters crowing,or other livestock making a noise 

I agree whole heartedly, Rick.  We love waking up and hearing the roosters (not the other way around, we are used to them).  The rest of the time it is extremely quiet.  There were people in Melbourne, that moved to the CBD, then complained about the pub noise and got the live music closed down.  The pub had been playing live music since the 70s!!  If you don't like the noise in the city, don't move there!! 

[Surferdude]

Sorry but I think it's disgusting,the audible noise a light signal makes is NO WHERE near as loud as the reversing beepers,what next,lets stop emergency services using sirens between 9.30pm and 6.30am, if you want to live in the city put up with the noise.

Same as F*#*wits  that move to the country and then complain about roosters crowing,or other livestock making a noise 

My point stands Rick.
There is no need for the pedestrian crossing beepers to work on every change of the lights on the off chance there may be a vision impaired person there at Midnight or 3 am.
It's easy to put them on a link to the button you press to get the "Walk" sign to work.

It's all very well to say don't move to the city but our urban planners are consistently urging just such a move and promoting it with more and more high rise apartments in the city precincts.
Our lifestyle and its demands are changing, due to population increases and other factors, so some adjustments are always going to be necessary.

[Just Rick]

Yea Jamie,I seen it happen over here over the years,they opened a new housing estate some years ago,next to a well established light aircraft field,people got their land dirt cheap at the time and since every now and then have a push to close it down.

I never sleep properly when I stay in town,far to much noise,much like when some come up here they say it is far to quiet,just peeves me off when people move into an area when they know all to well their is either industry,pubs,traffic or livestock and then want to change it as it doesn't suit them,my simpleton view is if you don't like it F*#^ off

[rustynutz]

There is no need for the pedestrian crossing beepers to work on every change of the lights on the off chance there may be a vision impaired person there at Midnight or 3 am.
It's easy to put them on a link to the button you press to get the "Walk" sign to work.

I suspect the pedestrian crossing beepers would actually help the vision impaired person to find the crossing in the first place... 

[Doggie 1]

Most people here press the button anyway then walk on the red. 
It infuriates me because all drivers then have to sit through the pedestrian cycle for no pedestrians.

It used to annoy me, too. Then I worked out that, if they press the button and wait for the "Walk" sign, I'd have to wait anyway, so I haven't really lost any more time either way.

Yes, but if they were going to walk on the red anyway and didn't press the button, we wouldn't have to wait at all.
Would we? 

[Just Rick]

Most people here press the button anyway then walk on the red. 
It infuriates me because all drivers then have to sit through the pedestrian cycle for no pedestrians.

It used to annoy me, too. Then I worked out that, if they press the button and wait for the "Walk" sign, I'd have to wait anyway, so I haven't really lost any more time either way.

Yes, but if they were going to walk on the red anyway and didn't press the button, we wouldn't have to wait at all.
Would we? 

  good point,outways Phils 

[Phil №❶]

Same as F*#*wits  that move to the country and then complain about roosters crowing,or other livestock making a noise 

Lucky we have double glazing or I might have been one of those.... 

 

[beerman]

Sorry but I think it's disgusting,the audible noise a light signal makes is NO WHERE near as loud as the reversing beepers,what next,lets stop emergency services using sirens between 9.30pm and 6.30am, if you want to live in the city put up with the noise.

Same as F*#*wits  that move to the country and then complain about roosters crowing,or other livestock making a noise 

I think you will find they don't unless they are approaching an intersection with a red light or traffic (at least in QLD the Ambulance certainly does).

There is a massive problem with people moving into an area and expecting to modify the environment to suit their needs. Moving near a tip  then campaigning to shut it down and the like, hell people who have moved into the city have successfully shut the pubs that have been pumping out live music for decades.

My theory is that anyone who moves into an area should modify their lifestyle to adapt to those that were there first. Problems with city noise, double glaze and insulate.

[FatBoy]

I was doing some night flying at Moorabbin airport early last year.  The guy I was flying with told me the areas to avoid overflying, as these areas were established before the airfield was built.  Fair enough.  He told me that the other areas were "fair game" but "fly neighbourly" to avoid any unwanted attention.  Apparently the newer estates were selling blocks and telling buyers that the council was going to close down the airport in the next few years, in the bid to sell more blocks.  Unfortunately, Moorabbin airport is Federal land, and will not be shut down in the near future.  It still doesn't stop people complaining.

Move next to an airport and complain about aircraft noise.  They must be Liberal/Labor/Greens voters (please cross out that which doesn't fit your particular political persuasion).

[Aussie Keith]

The historic Lakeside Park raceway was once so far away when it opened you really needed to pack a lunch to go there. It is bordered by a golf course, a lake where water skiing occurs on the weekends and railway lines. In recent years housing development has encroached and residents complained about the noise. To its credit the council responded stating that residents who moved into the area where the race track and other recreational activities have been established for over 50 years should not be surprised that its noisy. The racetrack and water skiing stays, and residents need to get over their stupidity. 

[Aussie Keith]

On topic again Surferdudes suggestion makes so much sense I am amazed they are not designed that way now. I expect that they may well be. It just makes sense that they should be like that.

[Surferdude]

The historic Lakeside Park raceway was once so far away when it opened you really needed to pack a lunch to go there. It is bordered by a golf course, a lake where water skiing occurs on the weekends and railway lines. In recent years housing development has encroached and residents complained about the noise. To its credit the council responded stating that residents who moved into the area where the race track and other recreational activities have been established for over 50 years should not be surprised that its noisy. The racetrack and water skiing stays, and residents need to get over their stupidity.

It did get shutdown for some years though, Keith, as much for the noise complaints as for financial issues with the track administration. And Surfers Paradise Raceway went because the Japanese built a couple of golf resorts next door then, in order to stop the noise complaints, bought the property.
Amaroo Park Raceway in the Hills District north of Sydney went purely on the basis of noise complaints.

And Caloundra Airport has continually been the subject of noise complaints over the years like Moorabin. The differe3nce here is that, yes it was here first and I don't have a problem with it at all, even though it's pretty much on our doorstep. The issue is now that a major helicopter training school, after being turfed out of the Noosa airport precinct by the council, has begun using Caloundra for it's take-off and landing and touch and go type exercises. And they are flying over houses which aren't under the airstrip flight paths - sometimes for hours at a time. I reckon those residents have a genuine beef.

[TheReaper]

For the blind people at intersections.  Why not just set the buttons to vibrate when it's safe to walk and they just keep their hand on top of the button until it buzzes.....

[rustynutz]

Or, as the beeper doesn't need to compete with as much traffic noise, have the volume of the beeper reduced a few decibels late at night....
That way vision impaired people can still locate (by ear) where pedestrian crossings are located.

[Surferdude]

Those crossings normally have dimple strips at them so they can be felt with their feet.

[rustynutz]

Yes, at the crossings....but I figure if they can hear the beepers from some distance away then finding the actual crossing will be that much easier for them.

[Surferdude]

Yes, at the crossings....but I figure if they can hear the beepers from some distance away then finding the actual crossing will be that much easier for them.

Really?
How do they negotiate anywhere if they aren't near a crossing then.
I'm not being a smart arse here. Genuinely, they are adept at manouvering around by themsleves, so I doubt there is a pressing need for them to be able to hear a crossing signal from a distance.
Else they'd be falling off footpaths and walking into light poles.

[beerman]

Isn't the idea of the beep to identify that the crossing is controlled, in the same way the red/green man is for sighted persons.

Otherwise the blind may attempt to cross the crossing unaware that it is controlled by lights.

[Surferdude]

Isn't the idea of the beep to identify that the crossing is controlled, in the same way the red/green man is for sighted persons.

Otherwise the blind may attempt to cross the crossing unaware that it is controlled by lights.

I think you might be right beerman.
I seem to remember that, when the "Don't Walk" is illuminated, there's a single beep emitted with quite a gap between each one. Then when "Walk" happens, there's a rapid "beep, beep, beep"

[rustynutz]

Think you pretty much answered that question for me, beerman.... 

[rustynutz]

Speaking of pedestrian crossings... 

Touch card for pedestrian crossings would make it safer for elderly, disabled | News.com.au

[Doggie 1]

For the blind people at intersections.  Why not just set the buttons to vibrate when it's safe to walk and they just keep their hand on top of the button until it buzzes.....

What if the blind person has two blind kids to hang on to as well?