[i30CRDI]

Hi Guys,
Just had the 15000km service on the CRDI as per my earlier post. After a 10km drive home I decided it would be wise to check the oil level, I was surprised to see how black the oil was after such a short trip considering it had 'just been replaced'. I know from experience that some old oil gets trapped in nooks & crannys, pipes etc but this seemed excessively dirty & not the usual few black specs of old oil. I had a look at the sump plug to see if there was any evidence of it being removed but its squeeky clean & no sign of recent tampering traces of oil etc. So unless they extracted the old oil through the dip stick tube I suspect it was just topped up rather than changed. Here are a couple of pics of the oil & sump plug, would you agree that this is lookin a bit suss? I'm thinking of sending a sample off for analysis.
BTW, The oil level was just above minimum b4 the service & I brought this up as the car has only done 9000km, they reckon they had to top up 900ml & its not uncommon for this amount of oil to be used by new engines, none of my past new cars have used this much oil.
Cheers
Mark

[deleted]

[eye30]

Doesn't sound/look right to me.

Does the invoice show a new filler plug, oil filter and of course oil?

When I had my 1st service the oil was a lovely clean colour for sometime before it started to change to a dark colour. 
Even today some 11.75 months later it still has a "clean look" to it.  (Going in for 2nd service in 2 weeks).

If they did an oil change I wonder if they did an engine flush to remove all traces of the old oil from the engine.  That's if they actually did an oil change.

PS  look at he the oill filter and see if that has been changed.  I presume a new 1 would be clean spaking clean etc.

[Blue]

Looks to me like it should be referred to consumer affairs... or equiv.

That oil has NOT been changed.
Well, to be completely 2009 PC, the oil has not been changed for NEW oil.
It may well have been changed for OLD oil.

[i30CRDI]

Yep, Invoice states
Magnatec 5W40 full synthetic
Service kit oil filter
Gasket Oil Plug
Looks like i'm going to Dept of fair trading then.......
Cheers

[2i30s]

thats a bit suss ,was your oil done at a hyundai dealership. at 1000ks.

[i30CRDI]

Is the oil filter a screw on canister type? had a quick look for it but couldn't see anything that resembles an oil filter at first glance.

[i30CRDI]

thats a bit suss ,was your oil done at a hyundai dealership.

I'll need to get some legal advice if it comes to it before I can answer that.

[2i30s]

contact hyundai australias head office in sydney and say your not impresed,it should be a lot cleaner than that. you can even contact the nrma for advice.

[Lorian]

I would contact the dealer first, and see what they say.

[i30CRDI]

thats a bit suss ,was your oil done at a hyundai dealership. at 1000ks.

No they didn't change it on the 1000km service, this was the 15000km & they should have changed it & have charged me for it anyway.

[Shambles]

I would contact the dealer first, and see what they say.

I would agree. That oil is not new and the plug has not budged since first fitted IMHO.

Ask the dealer

[andys101]

To put a different view to everyone.

I have had much dirtier oil AFTER oil and filter changes.
After 15000k the oil would be a lot dirtier than that.
You could have had the work carried out by a very clean Mechanic who sprayed the sump plug with brake cleaner after changing the oil (like I allways do) and then road tested it and rechecked for leaks (whats the point checking for leaks when its not been cleaned in the first place)
If you are concerned, speak to your garage, dont go and get all and sundry involved at the begining as this will alienate yourself from the dealer.

Just my thoughts.

Andy.

[2i30s]

that's a bit suss ,was your oil done at a Hyundai dealership. at 1000ks.

No they didn't change it on the 1000km service, this was the 15000km & they should have changed it & have charged me for it anyway.

i was just curious if it was changed at 1000ks.mine was done at 1000ks and I'm now at 5500ks and still looks new.hope it turns out to be something overlooked or forgoten and not a case of them ripping you off. cheers  Steve.

[accim]

Well, I think there's no need for panic. You can take your car to some other Hyundai service and they will give their opinion..

You must also know, that your service is using 5W40 oil, when most services decide to go with 5W30. Mine uses 5W40 too and I think 5W40 looks darker than 30 one.. I have 38,000 kms now, in approx 2 weeks I'll have 40,000 and my car is going to service then.. I'll check how mine looks after changing oil, but I think it's similar to yours..

These two pictures are pictures taken few minutes ago. My last oil change was when I had 20,000 kms, now I have, as I've written 38k kms. So that means I've done 18,000 km with it..

The color of your oil is very "light" when you look at the stick..

Oh and yes, I've also heard that oil in diesel engines gets black already after 5kms and that oil, that doesn't "turn black" (after some time) isn't doing it's job - because that means it isn't "cleaning" the engine or something like that

[New-Owner1]

Hi, usually after having my car serviced you can notice the oil much cleaner and visible as a shade of brown, I would contact the dealer first and give them the chance to put it right.

[MRH130]

Diesels will tend to blacken their oil much quicker than petrols, simply due to the soot from combustion. Having said that, without getting a look at the filter housing, it certainly looks as though the sump plug has only ever had heavy torque applied in the direction of tightening. Can't see any significant marks on the tightening side of the flats. Also, it's too clean around the plug unless they degreased it.

Note also that unless they've used Magnatec Professional, that's not the right oil either.

I'd get a second opinion from someone who can actually inspect the sump plug and oil filter housing - like another mechanic or your local motoring club (NRMA etc) before you go back and hassle the dealer too hard or get fair trading involved. If it was a petrol I'd say there is no question it hasn't been changed, but the fact it's a diesel just gives me pause...

[Blue]

That's pretty good advice I reckon MRHi30.

I'd say that this is not the original oil, particularly if it's done 15km.  When I took out my original fill at about half your mileage it was black as!  None was burnt up to that time nor since and I'm up to 13,000km now.

My suspicion at the time was that the blackness might have been due to some "moly" used during the engine assembly because it just looked surprisingly dark.  It might have been entirely due to sooting up while the rings were bedding. I've had no experience with a diesel before so a lot of guessing here.

Anyway, when I replaced it I left a significant amount in as I didn't replace the filter and the new oil darkened up immediately to look not unlike your sample although it's hard to tell from the picture how dark it really is.  My first replacement oil is still in and now looks a tad darker that yours but nowhere near as dark as the first fill did when I took it out.

So I think your oil has been changed but certainly there was no flush (and that's fine - no real advantage to do one IMO).

What I would be interested in if I were you is why it is (was?) using oil.  This might be related to sooting up, if it is, which would also account for the quick darkening.  Soot passes the rings to contaminate (and darken) the oil and similarly, oil passes the rings and gets burnt and is one way oil can be "consumed". This passage in both directions is normal (and required for cylinder lubrication) but in a new engine that right now should be near its optimum condition with good ring seal should be minimal. For a comparison, mine has done near the same mileage as yours and as I said, has needed zero top-up and the oil shows only moderate darkening.

WRT the service, I'd be inclined to ask exactly what oil was used. You paid for it. To remove any doubt that it's not to your prefered standard you can supply your own - although you still have to trust they use it. I've heard stories of mechanics sticking your good stuff in their own car (they know good oil when they see it!) and filling yours with the standard bulk. I personally don't think this really happens.

[accim]

That's a good post Pip.

One more thing. When do you measure your oil? I know some people measure it when the car is hot, some when it's cold. I know, that if you measure it, right after you've turned off your car, it will show less that it actually is.. That's because, the oil didn't go back in that container or how do you call it? Because of that, you should always wait at least 5 mins after switching off your car.

I remember, about a month ago, I wanted to check my oil level and did that right after turning off my car.. It was at minimum and the look wasn't really nice.. But after 10 or 15 min it "got up" between 1/2 and max..

[i30CRDI]

Thanks for all the replys guys I really apprieciate the feedback.
The latest is I have contacted the Service Manager & he assures that the oil was replaced & even said he was present with a Hyundai rep at the time the car was serviced, that was a coincidence wasn't it. Anyway I'm keeping an open mind at this stage & some of you have made some valid points either way which is really helpful. The bottom line is the oil is quite dirty & has a strong carbon burnt smell, the sump plug also as most of you agree looks like it has not been touched since the factory. For those of you who never saw my earlier post on what the 15000k service should cost, there was some discussion between myself & the dealer in regards to the price of the service prior to me taking the car in. I was quoted $370 for the service which I thought was excessive for this service & as confirmed on this forum the normal price should have been around $250, anyway after several calls the dealer 'reluctently' offered did the service for $260, I can't help but think this has something to do with the outcome above (i'll teach the little prick sort of thing).
The other thing is they said the oil was $130 alone when trying to justify the higher price, the invoice later revealed the oil actually cost $52.
I've been in contact with Castrol & will remove 100ml of oil while the car has travelled less than 10km since the service, I understand that Castrol provide a service to provide an analysis on the oil so I have asked for further information.
Some have commented that the oil did not look that black for 15000k if it wasn't replaced, well the car has actually done 9000k & they did top it up 900ml with clean oil (1/5th of total) so this would have lightened the oil a bit.
Cheers

[Lorian]

If they did an oil change I wonder if they did an engine flush to remove all traces of the old oil from the engine.

Hyundai dont endorse or recommend the use of a flush. They also say any damage to seals cause by using flush will not be covred by warranty. Source: Tech service bulletin 09-EM-001

WRT the reduced cost of oil used over the original quote, it's quite possible that a lesser oil (with lesser cost to help restore their margin) was substituted since you beat them down more than $100. I agree that the quote was higher than others but this dealer might work on a higher profit margin. Argue that if you want but I expect they are entitled to do that even if you don't like it. It's your option to go where ever you want so long as the service is performed to meet Hy's specification.

Do the oil analysis. You might not get a definitive answer though.

If I were you, with the same suspicion, I'd feel the same way... follow through and let us know the outcome.

[i30CRDI]

WRT the reduced cost of oil used over the original quote, it's quite possible that a lesser oil (with lesser cost to help restore their margin) was substituted since you beat them down more than $100. I agree that the quote was higher than others but this dealer might work on a higher profit margin. Argue that if you want but I expect they are entitled to do that even if you don't like it. It's your option to go where ever you want so long as the service is performed to meet Hy's specification.

Do the oil analysis. You might not get a definitive answer though.

If I were you, with the same suspicion, I'd feel the same way... follow through and let us know the outcome.

I still think $260 was a fair price for this service & I would rather they had turned around & said no they could not do it for that price rather than compromise on the oil (If that ends up being the case), at the end of the day the oil is the most important part of the service.They have to honor the warranty for the next 4 years anyway so its in everyones best interest that the oil is replaced.
Cheers

Consider this: If they didn't change the oil but just topped it up they may have been thinking along the lines of... the car has only done 9,000km so next service should be at 18,000km and this figure (ignoring the time period) is not too unreasonable for the life of good oil, particularly when you consider, as you said, they would have topped-up by 20% and perhaps similar again by next service.  All considered, I doubt the engine will cause the warranty (nor the dealer) any trouble even if the oil was not changed.

If  you end up not knowing or decide not to pursue it why not just pay a local mechanic to stick in oil you provide (or do it yourself - I do my own intermediate changes) and call it quits?

[Merlot]

i have a fleet of diesel buses and although they have done a few miles the oil is black after just starting it to fill the filter before re checking levels as for the sump plug I always wipe the sump otherwise you dont know if it is leaking or not I think you will find they did change it just depends how long they drained it for before they refilled it. If they were really busy might not have waited till every drop was out. I would rather do an oil change on a petrol any day diesel oil is black and shitty and doesnt come off to easy. I think it is fine

[eye30]

Just had my car seviced last Friday.

Checked today, day 4, and the oil is so clear you would think there is none in the sump.

[2i30s]

If they did an oil change I wonder if they did an engine flush to remove all traces of the old oil from the engine.

Hyundai dont endorse or recommend the use of a flush. They also say any damage to seals cause by using flush will not be covred by warranty. Source: Tech service bulletin 09-EM-001

next weekend im getting my 15000 service done and i noticed lorians post about oil flushing.my service manager told me that at 15000kms the engine gets a flush.  can someone please pm me the tsb  09-EM 001. 

[Lorian]

I think this was actually an elantra touring TSB (i30 in the US market place) so the TSB should be available on www.hmaservice.com.

Obviously the advice might vary from country to country, but I wouldn't have thought so.

It continues to be a great shame that Hyundai UK and Hyundai Australia don't publish TSBs, even if they only published the titles and descriptions, without the fix information, it would be most useful to customers. I can understand why they have issues in doing so though.

[2i30s]

thanx for the info Lorian,if Hyundai in one country don't allow an oil flush, why i wonder is that some country's its OK.