ESC and PS fail

wheeler · **April 02, 2016, 07:02:16**

Administrator Comment In reference to

Thanks for this post. I now have a 2010 I30CW diesel auto, only 27 000 on the clock, and it has developed the same symptoms. The recalls have been done, but it still occasionally has the ESC and power steering fail. So yesterday dropped in to Makin & Luby (Heidelberg, Vic), to discuss the issue. Luckily they seem to be on the ball, spent 1/2 an hour testing, and have come back to me with the bad news that there needs to be a replacement electric power steering motor, some $4 400 worth. The car is over a year out of warranty, but luckily I took out an extended warranty from RACV 18 months ago when I bought it.

However Makin & Luby have suggested that they take the first step, and see if Hyundai will come to the party. Hopefully they will. I am thinking of firing off an email to them because the car is not fit for purpose and has a known fault, as documented on these pages. Consumer affairs might be interested if they decline to party.

So, the situation now is that the wife (bless her) won't drive the car, and I hesitate because I use hand controls (use a wheelchair due to paraplegia), so can only have one hand on the steering wheel. Losing power steering presents me with a few extra issues. So, I reckon I can put together an email to Hyundai which lays it on the line, that a known fault is forcing me to drive an un-roadworthy car, which as a person with disability I am loath to do, but not driving it takes away my independence. Will report back on the outcome.

Asterix · **Reply #1: April 02, 2016, 07:48:12**

Hi wheeler

Sorry to hear about your troubles, but a 1990 i30..

(

)

Dazzler · **Reply #2: April 02, 2016, 09:27:16**

Wheeler.

You seem to be handling the situation very well. Hopefully they will come to the party (as they should)

ibrokeit · **Reply #3: April 02, 2016, 11:57:38**

Quote from: Asterix on April 02, 2016, 07:48:12

Hi wheeler

Sorry to hear about your troubles, but a 1990 i30.. ( )

What?!? 1990 i30?!? Oh I see, wheeler made an edit - thought you were loosing it Asterix... well more than you have

Wheeler, the regulars here are crazy and love to tease on typos just so ya know.

Contacting Hyundai might be an idea, however the approach from the service centre might be all that is needed. I recall someone posting their 6-7yo i30, brought used IIRC less than a year before, had an auto gearbox lockup into 3rd only. Hyundai reportedly replaced it without charge - course that may have been due to the whatever the specific failure mode was (e.g. how the f*ck could that happen?!).

In anycase expliaining you're specific situation is probably useful. With not fit for purpose, known fault discussed on unofficial user forum, consumer affairs as backup only.

Can definitely understand you not wanting to drive it much being you use hand controls. It was hard enough using both hands when mine failed, and you can't do that all the time.

Point to note there... when I was booking mine in (pre-recall) for complete EPS failure, which lead to replacement (car was still under warranty), I mentioned I could still drive it and so if a wait for parts was needed, I could do so... they advised if it was unsafe to drive they wouldn't be allowed to let me drive it. Maybe that is a QLD thing... anyway I had booked a free loan car which was quickly uped from 1-2days to a week.

cruiserfied · **Reply #4: April 02, 2016, 12:25:10**

Why are you jumping on the "fit for purpose" so fast? You have a problem that has been looked at and steps are being taken to attempt to get warranty, then you have the extended warranty as a backup. I dont think you will do yourself any favours with the dealer if you fire off defensive emails while they are trying to help you out.

Doggie 1 · **Reply #5: April 02, 2016, 17:19:33**

wheeler.

wheeler · **Reply #6: April 04, 2016, 03:13:40**

Quote from: cruiserfied on April 02, 2016, 12:25:10

Why are you jumping on the "fit for purpose" so fast?

Not using the "fit for purpose" issue yet, nor making any threats of going to consumer affairs - but thanks for the advice. Still mulling sending an email to Hyundai personally, just to back up what the dealer is doing - and to ensure Hyundai is aware that the fault was originally reported within the warranty period, when the stop light switch was repaired, and again after the end of the warranty, when the module was replaced under recall. And it can't hurt to ensure they know of my personal circumstances - that the car is particularly difficult to drive with hand controls when the fault occurs. Might speed things up if they know my personal circumstances (and a loaner isn't going to be much use to me).

Surferdude · **Reply #7: April 04, 2016, 04:44:21**

Quote from: ibrokeit on April 02, 2016, 11:57:38

Quote from: Asterix on April 02, 2016, 07:48:12
Hi wheeler

Sorry to hear about your troubles, but a 1990 i30.. ( )
Point to note there... when I was booking mine in (pre-recall) for complete EPS failure, which lead to replacement (car was still under warranty), I mentioned I could still drive it and so if a wait for parts was needed, I could do so... they advised if it was unsafe to drive they wouldn't be allowed to let me drive it. Maybe that is a QLD thing... anyway I had booked a free loan car which was quickly uped from 1-2days to a week.

Interesting point that. I'm pretty sure it's actually illegal to "impound" the vehicle along those lines. There was a major kerfuffle about it quite a few years ago and I seem to remember the practice was stopped. But I could be wrong.
It was used by unscrupulous workshops which supposedly found some unsafe issue with a car as a way of pressuring the driver to get repairs done.

The legal ramifications were tricky. Are you liable if you let a defective vehicle out onn the road? Are you stealing if you refuse to hand it over? And, if you get the owner to sign something acknowledging the issue before taking it, have you then presented a court with written evidence that you, as an acknowledged expert, allowed the car on the road?

ibrokeit · **Reply #8: April 04, 2016, 16:04:34**

Quote from: Surferdude on April 04, 2016, 04:44:21

Interesting point that. I'm pretty sure it's actually illegal to "impound" the vehicle along those lines. There was a major kerfuffle about it quite a few years ago and I seem to remember the practice was stopped. But I could be wrong.
It was used by unscrupulous workshops which supposedly found some unsafe issue with a car as a way of pressuring the driver to get repairs done.

The legal ramifications were tricky. Are you liable if you let a defective vehicle out onn the road? Are you stealing if you refuse to hand it over? And, if you get the owner to sign something acknowledging the issue before taking it, have you then presented a court with written evidence that you, as an acknowledged expert, allowed the car on the road?

Yeah - sought of did wonder about that. I wasn't worried in that instance because I had asked if there was a loan car available, turns out someone had cancelled (it had been booked for two days) which dove-tailed nicely with getting my vehicle inspected, though the service rep was surprised when I arrived... about having a loan car booked and for two days. I just replied they must have transferred the full booking. He said you will have your car back by 3pm today - a Tuesday. I just replied that would be great but when I made the booking I had been told it could be a day or so if parts were needed. Two hours later I was rung to be told had to get authorisation and parts sent and it would be Friday at the earliest, maybe Tuesday next week if there were any delays - and the loan car booking was extended for as long as needed.

However I did wonder some of the same things as you pointed out. I look at it this way - if you, as owner, arrange for it to be towed not driven away then they couldn't really stop you. If you drive it away they could possibly report you to the authorities? Of course some of these points might be covered by fine-print of the job/work-order you sign when dropping your car in for service.

Surferdude · **Reply #9: April 04, 2016, 21:26:41**

Now that you mention it, I seem to recall the "phone the authorities" ploy was what we ended up using, but only in extreme cases where the car was a wreck and we felt the owner woiuld just keep driving it.

Serious brakes issues like metal to metal pads/ linings or fluid leaks
And steering components about to break.

charlescrown · **Reply #10: April 05, 2016, 02:04:47**

That sort of issue is a very contentious one here in NSW. As a repairer is considered the technical expert and is liable if they reassemble the car in a dangerous state. If I were placed in that position I would insist the car be towed. Even if the owner signs that they take all responsibility they are not considered to have the technical knowledge to make that decision. It's like when you go to the races and on the ticket they absolve themselves of all liability. Doesn't hold up in court because there is always someone to blame. Holding a vehicle because of non payment is another interesting one. If it's owned by a tradie you cannot keep the vehicle. If it's private you must ensure all care of the vehicle till it's collected even if it takes ten years. The law is an ass.

charlescrown · **Reply #11: April 05, 2016, 02:22:49**

Oh and I forgot to say I think Hyundai might come the party. They do know your rights and it looks like the dealer is doing the right thing by you so like others have said just wait for the reply. I was only thinking the other day when I was driving my I30 that the steering would still feel nice if the engine cut out not like the old days with hydraulic assisted. As a last resort the "Fit For Purpose" is a great one to win your case.

wheeler · **Reply #12: April 05, 2016, 03:35:24**

Well all is well, Makin & Luby have received authorization for the repair, and it goes in on Monday. My understanding is that they have to replace the steering column, in particular, and it will be interesting to see how they get on with re-adjusting the hand controls. They consist of a complex set of adjustable rods, operating the accelerator and brake, through a gearbox attached to the column. Interesting, but I'm not going to be upset if I have to go back to the engineers who originally installed them. So, a happy customer here.

Dazzler · **Reply #13: April 05, 2016, 03:44:43**

Good to hear

Doggie 1 · **Reply #14: April 05, 2016, 08:02:29**

Grate two here!

charlescrown · **Reply #15: April 05, 2016, 08:14:52**

Absolutely fantastic to hear that news. As I said the manufacturers and sellers understand Australian law and do comply. Great news.
Yes I hope they can sort out the controls but I doubt it. That may need to go back to the fitter to be sorted.
Please post an update when solved.

ibrokeit · **Reply #16: April 05, 2016, 16:33:58**

As they said - Good Job!

rustynutz · **Reply #17: April 06, 2016, 04:40:44**

Quote from: charlescrown on April 05, 2016, 08:14:52

Yes I hope they can sort out the controls but I doubt it. That may need to go back to the fitter to be sorted.

That's what I believe will happen as the hand controls have nothing to do with Hyundai...

Still, it's good to hear Hyundai came to the party!

wheeler · **Reply #18: April 11, 2016, 06:29:49**

A thumbs up for the mechanic at Makin & Luby. Wish I could thank him personally. I hate it when you can't get past the service manager.

When I dropped in the car this morning, mentioned they'd probably have to remove the hand controls, because the steering column would need to be replaced, to be interrupted and told that it was only the power steering motor that needed replacement, wouldn't need to touch the hand controls.

Three hours later, I get a phone call to tell me the car is finished, but that the the steering column had been replaced (ha!), and that I would need to visit the engineer who fitted the controls and get them adjusted, because they had been removed and re-fitted. Which was precisely what I'd wanted to discuss with them in the morning.

If they'd heard me out, I was going to tell them not to bother trying to refit the hand controls, because they'd probably need readjustment anyway, and I had already arranged for the car to be picked up and driven to my engineer, who was quite happy to refit them.

However, just a minor issue - I'm told the ESC and PS are working fine - will be able to verify myself tomorrow once I can drive myself again.

eye30 · **Reply #19: April 11, 2016, 07:12:54**

Result ....... but only if the service person woukd have allowed you to speak.

ibrokeit · **Reply #20: April 11, 2016, 09:17:32**

Quote from: wheeler on April 11, 2016, 06:29:49

When I dropped in the car this morning, mentioned they'd probably have to remove the hand controls, because the steering column would need to be replaced, to be interrupted and told that it was only the power steering motor that needed replacement, wouldn't need to touch the hand controls.

Three hours later, I get a phone call to tell me the car is finished, but that the the steering column had been replaced (ha!), and that I would need to visit the engineer who fitted the controls and get them

As you say Ha!

I am assuming it was the service manager who interrupted, in any case who ever it was obviously didn't know the details of the required replacement - due to the fact, as you are no doubt aware, it is treated as sealed/one-unit part. On that basis I hope it wasn't - while it is a fair assumption (motor being replaced separately) for general public and drivers... one would hope the manager would have known about the ~$3k valued part for a warranty job, esp. being such part were part of recall action and other checks not that long ago.