[Just Rick]

http://dontbeafuckingidiot.herokuapp.com/

Runs, hides. And don't shoot the messenger.

NOW THAT is hilarious

[rustynutz]

That was excellent, Keith!

Oh and Dave, it will be you running and hiding if the Libs get in and f*ck things up.....
We will hunt you down.....Be afraid!   

[Ugly Mongrel]

That was excellent, Keith!

Oh and Dave, it will be you running and hiding if the Libs get in and f*ck things up.....
We will hunt you down.....Be afraid!   

Count me in, rustynutz. I'll ride shotgun on the back of the bike. Watch out Nullabor, he we come.

[Dazzler]

http://dontbeafuckingidiot.herokuapp.com/

Runs, hides. And don't shoot the messenger.

Gee that's a bit mean 

[Doggie 1]

That was excellent, Keith!

Oh and Dave, it will be you running and hiding if the Libs get in and f*ck things up.....
We will hunt you down.....Be afraid!   

   Then tell me Rusty, why aren't you all up in arms now after Labor has well and truly f*cked things up over the last six years?
Or being an avid Labor supporter, is that excusable?

I've said already that the Libs will cut spending etc etc because THEY HAVE TO thanks to reckless spending by Labor and the atrocious state of the books that will be inherited from Labor.
Don't blame the Libs. Put the blame exactly where it should be and that is with terrible successive Labor governments (yes, all three of them) that Australia has been inflicted with for the past six years.

[rustynutz]

  Then tell me Rusty, why aren't you all up in arms now after Labor has well and truly f*cked things up over the last six years?

It's only the Liberalites that are telling us that Labor has f*cked things up, everyone else reckons Australia is in pretty good shape.....Yes, there's been wastage but that's not just been confined to Labor, the Libs have wasted shiploads over the years too... 

[rustynutz]

Key Coalition policies not submitted for independent costings

The Coalition has not submitted its climate change, broadband and asylum seeker policies for independent costing ahead of Thursday's final release of figures before the election.

Read more: http://www.theage.com.au/federal-politics/federal-election-2013/key-coalition-policies-not-submitted-for-independent-costings-20130905-2t6dm.html#ixzz2dydnRz1t

[Aussie Keith]

Key Coalition policies not submitted for independent costings

The Coalition has not submitted its climate change, broadband and asylum seeker policies for independent costing ahead of Thursday's final release of figures before the election.

Read more: http://www.theage.com.au/federal-politics/federal-election-2013/key-coalition-policies-not-submitted-for-independent-costings-20130905-2t6dm.html#ixzz2dydnRz1t

Of course not, they are still making them up, I mean figuring them out, erm... quick - blame Kevin Rudd, asylum seekers and cost of living pressures on ordinary working Australians, or maybe Joe really has run out of fingers and toes. How Embassassment!! Right. 



Next Monday is going to be interesting, that's for sure.

[Aussie Keith]

  Then tell me Rusty, why aren't you all up in arms now after Labor has well and truly f*cked things up over the last six years?

It's only the Liberalites that are telling us that Labor has f*cked things up, everyone else reckons Australia is in pretty good shape.....Yes, there's been wastage but that's not just been confined to Labor, the Libs have wasted shiploads over the years too... 

Look to Europe and the US if you want to see how the austerity measures the Libs propose work out. I'd prefer we don't have any of that here.

Here's some light reading: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Austerity

In economics, austerity describes policies used by governments to reduce budget deficits during adverse economic conditions. These policies may include spending cuts, tax increases, or a mixture of the two.[1][2][3] Austerity policies may be attempts to demonstrate governments' liquidity to their creditors and credit rating agencies by bringing fiscal incomes closer to expenditures.

In macroeconomics, reducing government deficits generally increases unemployment in the short run.[4] This increases safety net spending and reduces tax revenues, to some extent. Government spending contributes to gross domestic product (GDP), so the debt-to-GDP ratio, an index of liquidity, may not immediately improve. Short-term deficit spending contributes to GDP growth particularly when consumers and businesses are unwilling or unable to spend.[5] Under the controversial[6] theory of expansionary fiscal contraction (EFC), a major reduction in government spending can change future expectations about taxes and government spending, encouraging private consumption and resulting in overall economic expansion.[7]

Initial austerity results in Europe have been as predicted by macroeconomics, with unemployment rising to record levels and debt-to-GDP ratios rising, despite reductions in budget deficits relative to GDP. Eurostat reported that unemployment in the 17 Euro area countries (EA17) reached record levels in March 2013, at 12.1%,[8] up from 11.0% in March 2012 and 10.3% in March 2011;[9] and that the overall debt-to-GDP ratio for the EA17 was 70.1% in 2008, 80.0% in 2009, 85.4% in 2010, 87.3% in 2011, and 90.6% in 2012.[10][11][12] Further, real GDP in the EA17 declined for six straight quarters from Q4 2011 to Q1 2013.[13] The U.S. Congressional Budget Office estimated in August 2012 that if the U.S. implemented moderate austerity measures, the unemployment rate would rise by over 1% and economic growth would be significantly reduced in 2013.[14] The U.S. partially avoided the "fiscal cliff" through the American Taxpayer Relief Act of 2012. U.S. unemployment has fallen steadily from a peak of 10% in early 2010 to 7.6% by March 2013.[15]

Turns out austerity measures DON'T WORK.  And our ruined economy has none of the hallmarks described above. Our debt as a ratio of GDP is low, we have a good credit rating, unemployment is low, the economy has experienced growth for years while others are in decline etc. I'm unsure where this BS that our economy is a smoking wreck is coming from. Its not even close.

Most of the economies on the periphery of the eurozone have been in free fall since 2009, and in the fourth quarter of 2012, the eurozone as a whole contracted for the first time ever.

As mentioned, Australia in comparison has experienced growth over the same period has low unemployment and a relatively low debt (which really isn't an issue to be honest) and is in good standing with the global credit agencies. This was achieved as we know by the injection of cash into the economy to stimulate employment and spending. In fact Swanny got a gong as a result.

http://www.news.com.au/national-news/wayne-swan-is-euromoneys-finance-minister-of-the-year/story-e6frfkvr-1226142199651

He was credited with the correct strategy during the global financial crisis of 2007-08.

The magazine applauded his "swift response to stimulate the economy'' despite "strong opposition at home'' and said he had "succeeded in getting most of the important decisions right'.

"These include putting in place an exit strategy for the stimulus and sticking to it, imposing a fiscal discipline that many other finance ministers refusing to adopt,'' said the magazine's citation of Mr Swan.

Those who imposed austerity measures were not as lucky. So why fix that which isn't broken using fiscal policy that is a proven dud - what we know of the proposed policies it at least?

Have a good read of the wikipedia article and if anyone would like more information I'd be happy to supply some scholarly economics articles which all point to the same thing which is the austerity road that Abbot is wanting to head down is not the place we wish to go based on years of academic research. Its what we in the IT world would say is not best practice. And its clear the Libs have no economic credentials to back them up anyway. They can't even get their sh!t together to deliver their costings on key policies.

Regarding a witty riposte, let me preempt by saying this, the opposition have demonstrated a complete lack of ability to convince me they know what they are talking about starting with the NBN and moving on to any of their other policy positions including the ludicrous proposition of buying boats off Indonesians. Seriously? That's the bottom line right there. Trust. They have failed to earn it.

[Phil №❶]

Sorry, but I don't agree.

That is a very in depth discussion about austerity etc, but I didn't hear much about the most significant contributor to why these measures need to be undertaken, INTEREST. Regardless of a country's GDP / debt ratio and other fancy intellectual arguments etc, interest is the killer and has to be managed correctly or else you end up in exactly the European position, as described. If they had no borrowings and critical interest debt, austerity measures would not need to be undertaken and the problems mentioned would not have occurred, IMHO.

[Aussie Keith]

Good point. Here's an article that supports that view: http://www.theaustralian.com.au/national-affairs/opinion/in-the-long-term-somebody-has-to-pay-to-cut-budget-deficit/story-e6frgd0x-1226625436191

However I thought the government is already working to bring the deficit down and was making inroads. A challenge has been balancing spending against declining tax revenues which are failing to meet forecasts. I agree a prudent government should always be seeking savings and efficient operations. But that's also a simplistic response to a complex requirement.

And that's why Hockey with the keys is a worry. He's clueless.

[Doggie 1]

First we had Waynus Swanus as treasurer and then when Krudd got back in he'd run out of options and gave the job to Chris Bowen and you talk about Joe Hockey as being clueless??? 

My goodness. Surely you can't think Bowen is anywhere near competent, can you? 

Honestly, Bowen stuffed up his previous portfolio so substantially and proved himself time and time again to be an incompetent twit and HE was given the keys you speak of.

Now that is scary.   

Where were you then?

[Phil №❶]

@keith_h

Traditionally, I lean more to the right than the left politically, but neither last time, nor this time will the Libs get my vote. I too am concerned that Hockey is clueless, more of a joker than a treasurer.

When I say I disagree, I disagree that austerity measures don't work. But like you, they need to be carefully and considerately applied to the population in such a way that the economy can bear the burden. Getting out of debt is just as painful as being in too much debt, but at least there is light at the end of the tunnel. I certainly wouldn't want to live in Greece at the moment, economically broke, cap in hand to the EU for handouts and a population in revolt due to hardline, but necessary, austerity measures. 

[Aussie Keith]

http://www.brisbanetimes.com.au/business/the-economy/hockey-closes-campaign-with-a-joke-20130905-2t7ab.html

[Doggie 1]

Rudd saying "he's hiding something" is very funny.

2007 election - Rudd produced his costings, as I have said before, at 5.00 pm on Friday afternoon when the election was the day after.
And he is now accusing JH of hiding something.    He must think we're all idiots.

[Aussie Keith]

You did read the article right?

After all the huffing and puffing, Hockeynomics is only proposing a $6 billion improvement in the budget’s cash bottom line over four years.

It’s not unreasonable to claim that the Coalition isn’t making any savings worth mentioning despite the many billions claimed - their “savings” mostly are immediately spent again and thus don’t save anything.

As suspected, there is nothing on offer here. Pascoe goes on to take a swipe at both parties for failing to do what was necessary.

The challenge this time is different, but it also requires honesty that has been seriously lacking on both sides of the game. Australian governments really can’t keep promising to give people more and tax them less.

Either party could have distinguished themselves by putting the tough choices out there for all to see. Instead they did the opposite and have offered us a, more of the same or b, expensive ppl scheme, buying boats from Indonesians, a half arsed national broadband network solution, rearranging the deckchairs. In other words, nothing of consequence from either side.

Its a big fail all round.

[Doggie 1]

Either party could have distinguished themselves by putting the tough choices out there for all to see. Instead they did the opposite and have offered us a, more of the same or b, expensive ppl scheme, buying boats from Indonesians, a half arsed national broadband network solution, rearranging the deckchairs. In other words, nothing of consequence from either side.

Its a big fail all round.

You've listed what you see as Liberal's failings but given Labor's failings over the last six years, I know who I'm going with. 
My hope is that most people will see through Labor's many, many failures and do the same thing for the sake of the nation.
Labor has had six years and during that time couldn't even sort out their own internal leadership issues, let alone effectively govern for the present and future of Australia.
It's a no brainer IMO.

[Phil №❶]

Edited

Either party could have distinguished themselves by putting the tough choices out there for all to see.

Its a big fail all round.

Agreed 100%, Last minute revelations just b4 the blackout is a tactic which displays cunning, cowardice, political manipulation of the voting public and for me discredits the party entirely. Yes they are playing within the rules of the game, BUT THIS IS NOT A GAME, why not release early and debate on the merits of the costings. If they're credible, there should be no problem and a whole lot more honourable than the present system.

[Ugly Mongrel]

Dave, you go on about Labor's failings, yet despite them Australia is in a very good place.

The last three years of a hung Parliament (Labor received 50.1% of the vote) made the Government's job very difficult and it was not helped by the Libs incessant negativity and scare tactics. Despite this, Australia's economy is the envy of the world, something conservative supporters, the Murdock media and idiots like Alan Jones, Andrew Bolt et al will just not accept as fact.

Anyone who thinks the Coalition will do better under the Libs when Joe "Fingers & Toes" Hockey himself said he would have run budget surpluses during the GFC, needs their head read.

[Phil №❶]

Sorry UM, but if Labor got 50.1% it wouldn't have been a hung parliament.

Please give the actual figure, as opposed to the negotiated figure.

[Doggie 1]

I'll make an appointment to get my head read tomorrow.
If we had been under a Liberal govt I have no doubt that we would be in a much better financial position than we are following the GFC.
Thank goodness the ALP inherited the books they did or we'd be up the creek well and truly.
Labor are bad financial managers and if you or I ran our household or business budgets the way Labor has the nation's financials, we'd be in dire straits.
I accept the fact that it was difficult to govern with a minority govt but I would have thought that was even more reason to be fiscally aware and conservative.
Every time Rudd or Gillard opened their mouth, especially when overseas, they handed out money like it was going out of fashion.
Add to that the miserable failure of Rudd's laughable border protection policy that he introduced after abolishing Liberal's proven policy and there's little wonder we are where we are.

[Ugly Mongrel]

Yet another bit of conservative bullsh1t. Governments are not households or businesses and they are never will be.

Pretty sad argument, really.

[Just Rick]

I wouldn't be slinging total crap at all the labor treasurers Dave,I watched twenty minutes of Joe Hockey,absolutuely struggling today at his press release of the liberals so called savings and at one point one of his flunky's actually physically pushed him out of the way and took over when he was asked a question,Unluckily I was not able to watched the whole press release(unlike Joe I have to actually work for a living,to get paid),but what I did see was a total sham,I actually thought Hockey was going to pass out or have  heart attack,not once in the whole twenty minutes I watched him struggle did he say where any of the coalitions funding was coming from.all he could keep repeating was we won't be spending this or that which labour did,so I tell a lie he did say they would cut foriegn aid by $4.5 Billion,which I don't have an issue with.

I have no doubts the coalition will get in on the weekend,but like some liberal voters of the last state elections,are now wishing they did not vote for them,with Colins latest election promise break and his parties line of increasing traffic enfringments to help fix his massive budget blowout,again I have no issue with them increasing fines,as long as it is put back into roads and the police services.

[eye30]

No mattwr the outcome, Come sunday you will all be griping about who won
Or didn't.

[Just Rick]

No mattwr the outcome, Come sunday you will all be griping about who won
Or didn't.

I won't,I am 99% sure who will get in,I'm just hoping when things go arrie (as they have in our state) and all the workers in this country are the ones get hit the hardest and the cost of living cost through the roof all the liberalites don't start crying,because it is going to happen.

[Phil №❶]

Yet another bit of conservative bullsh1t. Governments are not households or businesses and they are never will be.

Pretty sad argument, really.

This is how those out of touch with society see it, shame.

[eye30]

Just been reading about the SIZE of some election ballot papers and having to use a magnifying glass to read the names.....

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-asia-23931928

[Doggie 1]

Yet another bit of conservative bullsh1t. Governments are not households or businesses and they are never will be.

Pretty sad argument, really.

 

[Doggie 1]

I wouldn't be slinging total crap at all the labor treasurers Dave,I watched twenty minutes of Joe Hockey,absolutuely struggling today at his press release of the liberals so called savings and at one point one of his flunky's actually physically pushed him out of the way and took over when he was asked a question,Unluckily I was not able to watched the whole press release(unlike Joe I have to actually work for a living,to get paid),but what I did see was a total sham,I actually thought Hockey was going to pass out or have  heart attack,not once in the whole twenty minutes I watched him struggle did he say where any of the coalitions funding was coming from.all he could keep repeating was we won't be spending this or that which labour did,so I tell a lie he did say they would cut foriegn aid by $4.5 Billion,which I don't have an issue with.

I have no doubts the coalition will get in on the weekend,but like some liberal voters of the last state elections,are now wishing they did not vote for them,with Colins latest election promise break and his parties line of increasing traffic enfringments to help fix his massive budget blowout,again I have no issue with them increasing fines,as long as it is put back into roads and the police services.

My thoughts on the State Liberal govt's measures are well documented here.
If Liberals f*ck up, I say so, and they have in WA.

[Phil №❶]

Yet another bit of conservative bullsh1t. Governments are not households or businesses and they are never will be.

Please explain why the same rules for profitability, don't apply.